A few King's Cross bugs & issues

That's approach control to yellow.

Swinton (yorks) also does that on S631 when the line is set for Doncaster, the driver gets flashing yellows onto a yellow which steps up about the time a train enters the platform, which varies dependent on the trains speed of course.

jc92 in post 129979 said:

That's approach control to yellow.

Swinton (yorks) also does that on S631 when the line is set for Doncaster, the driver gets flashing yellows onto a yellow which steps up about the time a train enters the platform, which varies dependent on the trains speed of course.

Looking at the control tables, the yellow is released upon occupation or 383 or 385 tracks - basically 200yds after signal 459. Nothing to do with train speed. The regs basically state that the junction signal can be released to >Y once both the junction indicator and signal are visible.

I'm aware the sim releases it later.

GeoffM in post 129981 said:

jc92 in post 129979 said:

That's approach control to yellow.

Swinton (yorks) also does that on S631 when the line is set for Doncaster, the driver gets flashing yellows onto a yellow which steps up about the time a train enters the platform, which varies dependent on the trains speed of course.

Looking at the control tables, the yellow is released upon occupation or 383 or 385 tracks - basically 200yds after signal 459. Nothing to do with train speed. The regs basically state that the junction signal can be released to >Y once both the junction indicator and signal are visible.

I'm aware the sim releases it later.

I was surprised in the KX example as from a driving point of view if the signal and junction indicator become visible together then the yellow aspect doesn't seem to serve any purpose, save of course to trigger an AWS warning.

I can understand if there's a double yellow beforehand as that would then enforce a speed reduction. This is what appears to happen for the corresponding Holloway DF to DS move.

DavidSplett in post 129982 said:

GeoffM in post 129981 said:

jc92 in post 129979 said:

That's approach control to yellow.

Swinton (yorks) also does that on S631 when the line is set for Doncaster, the driver gets flashing yellows onto a yellow which steps up about the time a train enters the platform, which varies dependent on the trains speed of course.

Looking at the control tables, the yellow is released upon occupation or 383 or 385 tracks - basically 200yds after signal 459. Nothing to do with train speed. The regs basically state that the junction signal can be released to >Y once both the junction indicator and signal are visible.

I'm aware the sim releases it later.

I was surprised in the KX example as from a driving point of view if the signal and junction indicator become visible together then the yellow aspect doesn't seem to serve any purpose, save of course to trigger an AWS warning.

I can understand if there's a double yellow beforehand as that would then enforce a speed reduction. This is what appears to happen for the corresponding Holloway DF to DS move.

I suspect it's to avoid the risk of reading through and seeing a green junction signal on dead straight track, while the flashing yellow is in front of the driver.

In the Holloway case there's no FY, the sequence goes G then Y+JI, which steps up once the train has passed over the magnet. It's the absence of flashing yellows which to me seems odd. If it went FY then Y+JI stepping up then it would be logical. I suppose in an ideal world it would be a completely free G, but the speed profile doesn't quite seem to allow for that.

DavidSplett in post 130001 said:

In the Holloway case there's no FY, the sequence goes G then Y+JI, which steps up once the train has passed over the magnet. It's the absence of flashing yellows which to me seems odd. If it went FY then Y+JI stepping up then it would be logical. I suppose in an ideal world it would be a completely free G, but the speed profile doesn't quite seem to allow for that.

The requirements for that are different to FY. Yellow over a junction is very common on the Southern region, sometimes by holding the signal *after* the junction at red until the train is within sight of the signal, or passed over the AWS magnet, whatever the individual requirements for that junction are.

Interestingly the KX panel doesn’t seem to hold the signal after at danger as far as I can see from photos of the panel. For the DF to DS move there’s a view on the internet of that move set, and the panel shows all the signals “off”. I presume that carries through to what the actual signal heads do on the ground?

Yellow over a junction is very common on the Southern region, sometimes by holding the signal *after* the junction at red until the train is within sight of the signal, or passed over the AWS magnet, whatever the individual requirements for that junction are.

Of course the holding of the signal after the junction at red does in theory have a less obvious benefit, protection against a wrong route given and taken operating incident.

If for instance I'm doing 75 mph in my lovely class 508 unit approaching Purley on the down fast and I see a green on the end of platform 2, then it is straight in with the brake and initialise a radio conversation with the panel 2 signaller at Three Bridges 'A' box to advise him that I am unable to go that way (both 508 units and Tonbridge drivers banned via the Quarry)

Paul

DriverCurran in post 130061 said:

Of course the holding of the signal after the junction at red does in theory have a less obvious benefit, protection against a wrong route given and taken operating incident.

If for instance I'm doing 75 mph in my lovely class 508 unit approaching Purley on the down fast and I see a green on the end of platform 2, then it is straight in with the brake and initialise a radio conversation with the panel 2 signaller at Three Bridges 'A' box to advise him that I am unable to go that way (both 508 units and Tonbridge drivers banned via the Quarry)

Paul

Would that hold true in a 3-aspect area though?