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| Train Scheduling 25/07/2012 at 00:06 #34306 | |
Mickster66
84 posts |
Before I begin this post proper I am donning my tin helmet and visor as no doubt I will probably face yet another stoning from certain persons. My issue is involving the WTT SHumbs 15th Oct 2009 V5 (0445 start). At the present moment in the sim I have 6K22 approaching Immingham Bulk Terminal almost 1 hour late due to delays at Santon FOT apparently. However, 6T24 has been dispatched from the terminal 29 minutes early. As 6T23 is already in Santon FOT all available iron ore sets would be in action, so where would the extra set of tipplers have come from to form 6T24? The iron ore sets are made up of two full sets of 24 tipplers and a single half set (12 wagons) held at Immingham Bulk Terminal for replacement when maitainence is due. This half set will replace 12 wagons on one of the active sets and then those 12 vehicles would then become the spare half-set. A small number of other tipplers are also extant. 6K22 would in reality enter the Bulk Terminal then be loaded with a fresh consignment of iron ore for Santon then depart as 6T24. The fastest time this would take would be just over 40 minutes. Obviously no rule has been built into the WTT to cater for this fact. For 6K22 to meet its next working would be in these circumstances impossible. The only way 6K22 could ever meet 6T24 would be if the earlier 6T23 had been cancelled at Immingham Bulk and its set used to form 6T24. But as 6T23 was already at Santon this is not possible. This is the case for all iron ore services on this run. Log in to reply |
| Train Scheduling 25/07/2012 at 11:02 #34317 | |
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Danny252
1461 posts |
" said:Obviously no rule has been built into the WTT to cater for this fact.Do I hear a volunteer to do the work? 
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| Train Scheduling 25/07/2012 at 17:06 #34330 | |
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Noisynoel
989 posts |
As I have mentioned elsewhere, at NO STAGE have I stated that the timetable is 100% accurate. It is just a 'representation' of the timetable for that date in that area. If you want to ammend it so that it is 100% accurate, then, as has been done by another user, feel free, just make sure that if it is released then credit is given where due.
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| Train Scheduling 21/10/2013 at 20:17 #50214 | |
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alanwilliams
9 posts |
I am having a problem with 4d22 entering from thorne jct and destination Hargreaves coal terminal , hargreaves is not mentioned in the immingham area where this train should go Log in to reply |
| Train Scheduling 21/10/2013 at 20:43 #50215 | |
Steamer
3986 posts 
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" said:I am having a problem with 4d22 entering from thorne jct and destinationHargreaves CT is accessed from Immingham Storage Sidings, and you need to phone Immingham Reception for permission for the train to enter. As a rule of thumb, any locations in the Immingham area which aren't labelled on the panel tend to be in either Reception or Storage Sidings. There's a full list of where the various sidings are on the Wiki, and a map here "Don't stress/ relax/ let life roll off your backs./ Except for death and paying taxes/ everything in life.../ is only for now." (Avenue Q) Log in to reply The following users said thank you: alanwilliams, AndyG |
| Train Scheduling 21/10/2013 at 22:09 #50225 | |
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Aurora
183 posts |
Must admit, when I first played South Humberside and saw a train needing to go into Hargreaves CT, I just called everyone up one by one, hoping someone would accept it. Luckily one said yes. 
Nil. Log in to reply |
| Train Scheduling 22/10/2013 at 09:39 #50238 | |
onlydjw
456 posts |
There are 3 and a half full sets of iron ore tipplers currently in use (not two and a half). At the Santon end, the loco swaps onto the set left by the previous train. At the Immingham end, the loco waits with the set being loaded. As Noel said, the original default timetable did not have rules set up for some of the empty/loaded workings. Other TT's since released do include such rules to a greater or lesser extent. God bless, Daniel Wilson Log in to reply |
| Train Scheduling 22/10/2013 at 11:15 #50249 | |
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Finger
220 posts |
It would be a difficult problem making such set of rules, to exactly account for spare wagon sets. On the same note, how do the "Are alternatives", "Mutually exclusive" and "Must not run if X runs" rules work?
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| Train Scheduling 22/10/2013 at 12:08 #50257 | |
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onlydjw
456 posts |
I'm not the best person to answer questions on rules, as especially with mutually exclusive, have used that type of rule and had it not work. Regarding the first part and spare wagon sets - you wouldn't write rules for using the spare wagon sets - mainly as there spare half set would usually be out of traffic on maintenance, and is kept at Immingham Reception as far as I know (so you'd need a couple of trip workings etc). With the iron ore trains specifically, there are two locos and 3 sets of wagons in operation at any one time. To make it realistic, what should happen is that the empty set exits the sim at Immingham Ore Terminal, has a rule that <its loaded working> must not enter until x minutes after <its empty working> has exited the area - the x minutes being the time taken to load. Likewise at the Santon end. Using reality, the two loco diagrams and simply the even and odd numbered workings, so in the original example, 6K22 (empties) go into load, and 6T24 would be that loco's next working, so to be realistic, you should have rule "6T24 must not enter until x minutes after 6K22 has exited the area". This would repeat through the whole list of workings (eg 6K21/6T23, 6K23/6T25, 6K24/6T26 etc). With pretty much the same idea at the Santon end, it means you will only ever have 2 iron ore trains in the sim at any one time, with the third set of tipplers always being unloaded at the Santon end. The catch is that if they run very late (as regularly happens in reality), you'll never catch up (I write my rules with a bit of flex in them, but not too much). In reality, they will just cancel the next working from whichever end, and swap the train at that end from odd to even or vice versa. Eg 6K22 goes into Immingham empty, and has an hour's delay loading. Therefore, it's next working 6T24 is cancelled. and this loco and set forms 6T25, which can run to time. To get SimSig to do this in a game, you'd need to edit the rules so 6K22 forms 6T25 (not 6T24) and 6K23 forms 6T26 (not 6T25), and delete the rule for 6T26 forming off 6K24. If you do it this way, you avoid duplicating the next loaded working after the one you step up, or missing a move becasue a rule is stopping it from entering because it's inward working was cancelled. It's a little complicated, but exactly what a real control would have to manage. One day, with the new South Humberside, I look forward to being able to host a game and be a part of games to offer advice on this, where a TT has been written with rules to be realistic, and how to best deal with in game alterations without causing havoc! My Hybrid TT includes rules for the iron ore workings, and a lot of other workings based on reality (from a few years ago), so I would suggest a look at the rules in that TT if you want suggestions. If you've got any specific workings you're not sure on, then please ask away, and I'll do my best to answer them. God bless, Daniel Wilson Last edited: 22/10/2013 at 12:17 by onlydjw Log in to reply |
| Train Scheduling 22/10/2013 at 12:33 #50258 | |
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Jan
906 posts |
I did write up a Wiki entry explaining the "Are alternatives" rule based on what I could find in the forum and some experiments of my own. I hope it clears up more confusion than it creates, if not, please feel free to improve it.
Two million people attempt to use Birmingham's magnificent rail network every year, with just over a million of them managing to get further than Smethwick. Log in to reply |
| Train Scheduling 22/10/2013 at 15:46 #50261 | |
postal
5265 posts |
" said:especially with mutually exclusive, have used that type of rule and had it not work.That could have been a core code issue. The rule did not work correctly when it was first added to the list of rules available but the core code has been changed since then and the rule now works. “In life, there is always someone out there, who won’t like you, for whatever reason, don’t let the insecurities in their lives affect yours.” – Rashida Rowe Log in to reply |
| Train Scheduling 22/10/2013 at 15:52 #50262 | |
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onlydjw
456 posts |
I think you might be right here, and I think South Humberside is on a core code where it didn't work properly, as I tried it with the Hybrid TT I wrote some time back. I seem to remember asking about 5 times from what core code it does work, but nobody could ever give me an answer. God bless, Daniel Wilson Log in to reply |
