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| Track Circuits (Lengths & Speed) 10/04/2014 at 06:50 #58635 | |
CTCThiago
232 posts |
Hello All, I'm thinking here if this function would be helpful for users, is there a way to show Lengths and Speed of "TC's" on SimSig? Something like the Simplifier, My suggestion, if possible is the only vacancy Key (F12) or integrate with (F11) on a new tab, to show this information to the signaller (or Signalman). I think this is one of the most important informations to signallers take known, as it would help setting routes smarter and faster. Please SimSig community, what do you think about the subject? I'm open for discussions. Cheers, Thiago. (CTC). 
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| Track Circuits (Lengths & Speed) 10/04/2014 at 08:09 #58636 | |
maxand
1637 posts |
I believe we are as likely to see Lengths or Speeds of track segments as we are to see signal numbers next to signals; in other words, never. SimSig in its present incarnation can't support this as it does not support a font small enough. On the other hand, signalling apps such as Train Dispatcher have had Length displays for years as an option, though it does require switching between the normal (red snake) view and the Length view. As far as Speeds are concerned, wouldn't this depend on the type of train? Current speed is of course listed on the Train List. I'm not quite sure what speed display you are requesting here. If you want a speed display to calculate an ETA, that's something signallers are expected to guesstimate, until they introduce GPS signalling. Maybe the best option is for you to create your own table of Track segment lengths, say between Station A and Station B to keep handy as a reference. It's a good question; how DOES one find out the length of a particular track segment? One can only hope that in the dim and distant future, what is now represented as a font character will be replaced by a bitmapped font, permitting tiny fonts to be used. Last edited: 10/04/2014 at 08:14 by maxand Log in to reply |
| Track Circuits (Lengths & Speed) 10/04/2014 at 08:15 #58637 | |
Peter Bennet
5402 posts |
You can find the speeds in the Sectional Appendix which is linked from the Wiki somewhere. Peter I identify as half man half biscuit - crumbs! Last edited: 10/04/2014 at 14:36 by Peter Bennet Reason: Typo Log in to reply The following user said thank you: CTCThiago |
| Track Circuits (Lengths & Speed) 10/04/2014 at 08:57 #58638 | |
jc92
3690 posts |
normally (but not always) the importance Lengths, eg loops, platforms and sidings are listed in the wiki for the sim, most other TC lengths are irrelevant. as peter says the real speeds are listed in the sectional appendix, but several of the sims manuals list general linespeeds for various areas in the sim. could be one to add to the TC section of the F11 menu though I spose. Max: I dont think CTC was referring to adding TC details to the sim page itself, but being able to access them via a popup box like F11, in which case the boxes do support different fonts. " said: I believe we are as likely to see Lengths or Speeds of track segments as we are to see signal numbers next to signals; in other words, never. SimSig in its present incarnation can't support this as it does not support a font small enough. Euston? "We don't stop camborne wednesdays" Last edited: 10/04/2014 at 08:58 by jc92 Log in to reply The following user said thank you: CTCThiago |
| Track Circuits (Lengths & Speed) 10/04/2014 at 09:00 #58639 | |
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Kage
65 posts |
You can get the lengths and speed, in a bit of a roundabout way. Open the Incident Panel, go to the Track Circuit tab, click the mouse button above the list then click the TC you want to examine. It then highlights that TC in the list. Make a note of the ID (T####) and change to the TSR tab. Click Add, then select Individual Subroute, and select the U#### that matches the T###, there will be at least 2, and there's the length and speed for that route... Log in to reply The following users said thank you: maxand, CTCThiago |
| Track Circuits (Lengths & Speed) 10/04/2014 at 11:09 #58641 | |
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kbarber
1743 posts |
I think this is another one that's about the difference between a game and a simulation. A real-life signalman never had (and probably still never has) comprehensive information on track circuit lengths. Occasionally one or two will be listed - overlap TCs for a signal, for instance (the places I've seen that are for an IB signal in absolute block) or the berth track for a home signal, again in absolute block areas. One or two more can be derived from knowledge of signal positions. But in truth, it's pretty irrelevant; what's important is how long a train takes to cover a particular stretch, be it a track circuit, an AB section, a signal section or whatever. As always, this knowledge is what comes with experience - and here I mean experience in working the location concerned, not experience of signalling in general. When I became signalman at Marylebone (the 1967 mechanical box that replaced the original Passenger and Goods boxes of 1899 - not the IECC that's simulated), all my local experience gathered at Junction Road and on the North and West London lines became useless; I had to get used to how long trains took through each of the signal sections on the up from Neasden South, and how long from passing 38 starter to clearing the overlap of the next signal on the down. I was reasonably proficient in that after 3 weeks learning (a week on each shift), certainly sufficient that I could be put in charge. For the first month or two I needed to keep an eye on the diagram as trains approached. Beyond that, I could answer the description then go back to my newspaper in the confidence that I'd glance up at about the right time to set the road into the station and pull off. There's no substitute, I'm afraid, for that simple fact; all the knowing TC lengths in the world won't tell you, by instinct, when a train's taking longer than it should so you've that spare moment for a quick move. Log in to reply The following users said thank you: CTCThiago, Forest Pines |
| Track Circuits (Lengths & Speed) 10/04/2014 at 12:07 #58642 | |
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maxand
1637 posts |
Thanks Kage, you're right, but what a helluva way to go about it! To me, the value of knowing track segment lengths would be knowing the lengths of the segments ahead of level crossings so as to better estimate when to lower the barriers.
Last edited: 10/04/2014 at 12:09 by maxand Log in to reply |
| Track Circuits (Lengths & Speed) 10/04/2014 at 14:44 #58646 | |
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Peter Bennet
5402 posts |
Assuming you want to give the train the least restrictive aspect sequence (Green) and ARS works on two Greens ahead, then if you operate the crossing at the point no later than whan the train has passed the first green in the sequence of two, as it approaches the crossing, then you will probably be about right in most cases. But as Keith says - experience will tell you exactly what's best. Peter I identify as half man half biscuit - crumbs! Log in to reply |
| Track Circuits (Lengths & Speed) 10/04/2014 at 15:48 #58647 | |
postal
5265 posts 
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" said:. . . in the confidence that I'd glance up at about the right time to set the road into the station and pull off.Exactly why I do nearly all my SimSigging at 1:1 time. You (eventually!) develop exactly the same instincts as the real signaller to the extent that you can be working away at a problem at one end of the sim and your subconscious suddenly digs you to go to the other end as a route will need setting or an LC operating. “In life, there is always someone out there, who won’t like you, for whatever reason, don’t let the insecurities in their lives affect yours.” – Rashida Rowe Log in to reply |
| Track Circuits (Lengths & Speed) 10/04/2014 at 16:54 #58650 | |
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Kage
65 posts |
Of course, real signallers don't have to know some 30+ different boxes either! 
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| Track Circuits (Lengths & Speed) 10/04/2014 at 18:25 #58653 | |
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Stephen Fulcher
2084 posts |
Some sign more than you would think.
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| Track Circuits (Lengths & Speed) 10/04/2014 at 18:38 #58655 | |
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Danny252
1461 posts |
Certainly relief men would have covered a large number of boxes back in the day - possibly still the case now?
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| Track Circuits (Lengths & Speed) 10/04/2014 at 19:03 #58656 | |
headshot119
4869 posts |
" said:Certainly relief men would have covered a large number of boxes back in the day - possibly still the case now?Some of the North Wales / Marches / Cheshire lot must sign a lot. "Passengers for New Lane, should be seated in the rear coach of the train " - Opinions are my own and not those of my employer Log in to reply |
| Track Circuits (Lengths & Speed) 10/04/2014 at 19:19 #58657 | |
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hayleysmith
14 posts |
" said:Of course, real signallers don't have to know some 30+ different boxes either! :P Ooh, I don't know. A former relief man of my acquaintance wouldn't have been far off lol :whistle: Log in to reply |
| Track Circuits (Lengths & Speed) 11/04/2014 at 08:26 #58681 | |
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kbarber
1743 posts |
" said:Of course, real signallers don't have to know some 30+ different boxes either! :P Certainly not 30; I reckon my father knew no less than 50 as a relief signalman on the GN main line. Some of the top class men on the LM region (the old London Division) must have known just as many, in their case including some of the powerboxes. Log in to reply The following user said thank you: CTCThiago |