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| Signal 760 03/10/2010 at 13:35 #1847 | |
wilsontown
3 posts |
I'm having a spot of bother with Southampton. Apart from being new to the sim and therefore lacking in competence, I'm also finding that signal 760, on the up main between Redbridge and Millbrook, refuses to clear. I can set a route all the way to Southampton Central, the route shows up as white, but the signal does not clear and I have to tell the driver to pass the signal at danger. There's nothing to say that the signal has failed. What am I doing wrong?
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| Signal 760 03/10/2010 at 13:35 #11836 | |
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wilsontown
3 posts |
I'm having a spot of bother with Southampton. Apart from being new to the sim and therefore lacking in competence, I'm also finding that signal 760, on the up main between Redbridge and Millbrook, refuses to clear. I can set a route all the way to Southampton Central, the route shows up as white, but the signal does not clear and I have to tell the driver to pass the signal at danger. There's nothing to say that the signal has failed. What am I doing wrong?
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| Signal 760 03/10/2010 at 18:23 #11840 | |
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UKTrainMan
1803 posts |
Are you setting the route correctly from Signal 760 to either Signal 750 (Millbrook Up Slow) or Signal 752 (Millbrook Up Fast)? I say that because looking at Signal 760 I notice the overlap from the signal in rear (Signal 768) is quite extensive and goes all the way up to Shunt Signal 946 - this may be confusing you into thinking that the route starts at the shunt signal. If a route is correctly set from 760 to 750 or 752 then 'that backwards L' below 760 will light up white.
Any views and / or opinions expressed by myself are from me personally and do not represent those of any company I either work for or am a consultant for. Log in to reply |
| Signal 760 03/10/2010 at 18:47 #11841 | |
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Albert
1315 posts |
wilsontown said:There's nothing to say that the signal has failed. If the signal is failed, it doesn't show any color. A signal showing up red isn't failed. AJP in games Log in to reply |
| Signal 760 03/10/2010 at 21:27 #11846 | |
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wilsontown
3 posts |
Quote:Are you setting the route correctly from Signal 760 to either Signal 750 (Millbrook Up Slow) or Signal 752 (Millbrook Up Fast)? I say that because looking at Signal 760 I notice the overlap from the signal in rear (Signal 768) is quite extensive and goes all the way up to Shunt Signal 946 - this may be confusing you into thinking that the route starts at the shunt signal. If a route is correctly set from 760 to 750 or 752 then 'that backwards L' below 760 will light up white.Yep, that's the problem, alright...thanks for that! Log in to reply |
| Signal 760 03/10/2010 at 22:01 #11850 | |
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UKTrainMan
1803 posts |
wilsontown said:UKTrainMan said:No worries. After setting the route the shunt signal [946] clears first before the main aspect in rear [760] will clear, this is briefly covered here.Are you setting the route correctly from Signal 760 to either Signal 750 (Millbrook Up Slow) or Signal 752 (Millbrook Up Fast)? I say that because looking at Signal 760 I notice the overlap from the signal in rear (Signal 768) is quite extensive and goes all the way up to Shunt Signal 946 - this may be confusing you into thinking that the route starts at the shunt signal. If a route is correctly set from 760 to 750 or 752 then 'that backwards L' below 760 will light up white.Yep, that's the problem, alright...thanks for that! Thankfully this isn't real life as "shunt signals should not normally be used for trains with passengers on board; this is because most shunt routes don't have a safety overlap and the driver instead proceeds 'on sight', as there could well be other trains already in that section" (quoted text taken from here). Anyway, glad you've got it sorted. Enjoy Southampton, it's a great simulation for one or two people to play 
Any views and / or opinions expressed by myself are from me personally and do not represent those of any company I either work for or am a consultant for. Log in to reply |
| Signal 760 04/10/2010 at 00:09 #11853 | |
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Firefly
521 posts |
Quote:Thankfully this isn't real life as "shunt signals should not normally be used for trains with passengers on board; this is because most shunt routes don't have a safety overlap and the driver instead proceeds 'on sight', as there could well be other trains already in that section" (quoted text taken from here).It most certainly is real life. They are know as "running shunts" or "preset shunts" We have 4 types of "routes" available to us. 1) Main 2) Warner 3) Call-On 4) Shunt The route from 760 to 750 is a Main Route (So it has a full overlap and can be used by passenger trains) The route from 760 to 752 is a Main Route (So it has a full overlap and can be used by passenger trains) The route from 946 to 750 is a Shunt Route (does not have an overlap, can sometimes allow two trains in section and cannot be used by passenger services) The route from 946 to 752 is a Shunt Route (does not have an overlap, can sometimes allow two trains in section and cannot be used by passenger services) The reason that 946 signal is there is so that trains can come out of the FLT proceed "wrong direction" along the up line and then reverse once behind 946 signal. (the signal is very close to the points). If 946 signal wasn't there the train would have to travel even further in the wrong direction at a maximum speed of 15mph (as it's a shunt move) until it had got behind 760 signal. This would mean the move would take significantly more time and the limit of shunt would need to be further back towards Redbridge. The problem that we have is that 946 shunt signal is in the line of route between 760 and 750/752. This shunt signal must be cleared to a proceed aspect as we don't want trains passing signals at danger. Therefore 760 signal "pre-sets" 946 before allowing itself clear. The signaller just sets the route as if 946 signal isn't there and the interlocking does the pre-setting. To stand on the ground and look at 946 signal you wouldn't know whether a main route had been set from 760 or a shunt route had been set from 946 as the aspect will be exactly the same. (two diagonal white lights with a UF, US or Y). Although the aspect on 946 is the same, the route locking is very different. In semaphore days it would have been called a running shunt or running dummy and mechanical locking would force the signalman to clear the shunt signal before clearing the main signal. Hope that all makes sense. K Log in to reply |
| Signal 760 04/10/2010 at 07:32 #11854 | |
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pilotman
189 posts |
In addition in mech locking a preceding shunt signal may well have an overlap. This is because it is more difficult to prove the overlap on the running signal locking. Once the preceding shunt is "off" the running signal can clear as the overlap is already proved (providing all the track circuits in the route are clear). This can of course be a nuisance when using the preceding shunt signal as a normal shunt. Log in to reply |
| Signal 760 04/10/2010 at 18:43 #11859 | |
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UKTrainMan
1803 posts |
Just to clarify; My comment "thankfully this isn't real life" was based on the fact that it sounded to me as if 'wilsontown' was talking passenger trains passed Signal 760 and then setting Shunt Signal 946 for passenger trains (or possibly the other way round), which, as briefly covered here, isn't permitted for a train with passengers on-board due to the fact that it'd result in no overlap at the exit signal (either 750 or 752). I'd imagine if a signaller did that for real they'd probably have a few questions to answer and perhaps find themselves suspended pending further training/re-training or possibly even holding their P45 if there were any serious consequences from their actions. Any views and / or opinions expressed by myself are from me personally and do not represent those of any company I either work for or am a consultant for. Log in to reply |