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| View from the bottom 23/09/2015 at 08:08 #76149 | |
Mattyq
259 posts |
Firstly, admins please feel free to delete this if you feel that it is inappropriate. I just spent 2 weeks in the UK and travelled on all sorts of trains from tube to Eurostar. As detailed in another forum, I even got stuck on a train that was a total failure. For this, I have two comments:- 1. I agree that fare prices can be ridiculous - no argument there. 2. For everything else I say this... if you think for a minute that the British train system is bad, spend a week in Australia relying only on our railway system. I guarantee you will go home to the UK and hug the first railway/ tube employee you see. Not fat ..... fluffy!! (G Iglesias) Log in to reply The following users said thank you: JamesN, TimTamToe, John |
| View from the bottom 23/09/2015 at 09:24 #76156 | |
TimTamToe
664 posts |
Hope you had a good time over on our shores Matty! I agree with you, when I was in Melb in 08 for the tennis for Fed vs Nole, as happens the night matches go on, and even though it was only a 4 set match, we had to run back to Flinders St for the last train to the suburbs where we were staying. We were surprised that for a big city how early services were tailed down compared to the UK and especially with a major sporting event on that no additional later night services were put on, considering the time some of the matches at the Aussie Open finish. Gareth Log in to reply |
| View from the bottom 23/09/2015 at 15:46 #76169 | |
GeoffM
6376 posts |
I understand the likes of Chicago and New York have a "reasonable" metro service. But try Los Angeles: my local line, as was, featured no less than FOUR trains a day to Union Station - three in the morning peak and one at some random time in the afternoon. The busiest line sees an average of one an hour, but more bunched up in rush hour and longer waiting periods off-peak. Even the metro/light rail has a frequency of something like every 8 minutes or worse. Public transport here takes a lot of planning and is generally time-consuming, especially when things go belly up!
SimSig Boss Log in to reply |
| View from the bottom 24/09/2015 at 15:34 #76222 | |
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Mattyq
259 posts |
I'm probably way off the mark here but, from the information I've gleaned over the years, there appears to be an attitude in North America towards public transportation - and that is it is for the lower classes only. American businessmen wouldn't be caught dead on a train of any type but it's quite commonplace in most others countries. Such negative attitude towards public transport, especially railways and rapid transit systems, has an adverse impact on its sustainability, hence poor service. I was in awe of how busy British trains were and the ridership therein, particularly outside of peak times. Backpackers and businessmen shoulder to shoulder. Very impressive. One thing I have to ask, Geoff, your line to LA, is it considered suburban or interurban/regional? Not fat ..... fluffy!! (G Iglesias) Log in to reply |
| View from the bottom 24/09/2015 at 16:59 #76226 | |
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GeoffM
6376 posts |
" said:One thing I have to ask, Geoff, your line to LA, is it considered suburban or interurban/regional?60 miles, 1h20-1h30 duration, 7 stations, could be considered entirely within the LA metro area. Not sure what that is considered as! I don't live there anymore but getting figures for the duration, I notice the service is now 5 morning trains to LA and one in the afternoon, with 6 back in the afternoon only. Metrolink want to run a service to Victorville, my local station (one Amtrak a day in each direction). The pinch point is Cajon Pass where, several years ago, the host railroad (BNSF) added a third track to ease congestion. The proudly proclaimed the capacity increase from 100 to 150 trains a day. Metrolink reportedly asked "so we can run our one train a day then?" to which the answer was... wait for it... "sorry, no capacity". SimSig Boss Log in to reply |
| View from the bottom 25/09/2015 at 08:42 #76231 | |
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kbarber
1743 posts |
" said:... Cajon Pass where, several years ago, the host railroad (BNSF) added a third track to ease congestion. The proudly proclaimed the capacity increase from 100 to 150 trains a day.I take it that's the total in both directions? Liverpool Street eat your heart out... couldn't get any better than 48 an hour (24 each way) on the suburban lines, with steam traction & mechanical signalling. :whistle: Log in to reply The following user said thank you: flabberdacks |
| View from the bottom 25/09/2015 at 10:58 #76234 | |
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RainbowNines
272 posts |
" said:" said:A train every two and a half minutes using traditional methods. I take it Liverpool Street box only employed wizards?... Cajon Pass where, several years ago, the host railroad (BNSF) added a third track to ease congestion. The proudly proclaimed the capacity increase from 100 to 150 trains a day.I take it that's the total in both directions? Log in to reply The following user said thank you: flabberdacks |
| View from the bottom 25/09/2015 at 20:09 #76248 | |
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clive
2789 posts |
" said:Busy ones. 240 levers in West Box, 136 in East Box, plus some ground frames. Signalling diagram here Log in to reply The following users said thank you: RainbowNines, flabberdacks, john_s |
| View from the bottom 27/09/2015 at 14:02 #76298 | |
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kbarber
1743 posts |
" said:" said:That's right. Proper signalmen in those days. An engine dock siding at the country end of each suburban platform, facing for engines leaving the platform - engine would follow each departing train and the points would be swung as soon as the train cleared them, allowed the platform to be cleared before the train was clear of the throat. (Old-time signalmen will tell you it's possible to set a route quicker with mechanical points than with a panel; from experience I'm inclined to agree.) All mechanical signalling, Sykes Lock & Block instruments, signals and clearance treadles carefully placed to maximise throughput (including a 'closing up' signal on the down suburban approaching Bethnal Green, to keep approaching trains on the move as the preceding train left the platform)." said:A train every two and a half minutes using traditional methods. I take it Liverpool Street box only employed wizards?... Cajon Pass where, several years ago, the host railroad (BNSF) added a third track to ease congestion. The proudly proclaimed the capacity increase from 100 to 150 trains a day.I take it that's the total in both directions? It must have been quite something to see the peak in West Side box... Log in to reply The following users said thank you: flabberdacks, john_s |
| View from the bottom 29/09/2015 at 22:22 #76368 | |
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john_s
31 posts |
kbarber wrote: Quote: Liverpool Street eat your heart out... couldn't get any better than 48 an hour (24 each way) on the suburban lines, with steam traction & mechanical signalling.and Quote: All mechanical signalling, Sykes Lock & Block instruments,which prompts me to ask - is Sykes Lock and Block (which I've never seen in use) easier to operate than standard absolute block, e.g. in terms of bell ringing. I'm trying to imagine 48 trains per hour under absolute block, which would seem close to the maximum possible... I reckon that means you would have to attend to the bells roughly every 20 seconds (depends a bit on how you count, but assuming train out of section and is line clear are done together). Log in to reply |
| View from the bottom 30/09/2015 at 08:30 #76377 | |
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kbarber
1743 posts |
" said:kbarber wrote: Sykes is certainly different, but I wouldn't say it's easier (or more difficult) than a standard instrument. To give Line Clear you plunge rather than turn a commutator, to acknowledge Train On Line you turn a switch hook over the base of the plunger rather than turn the commutator, and to give Train Out of Section you turn the switch hook back again. What is different is that, having plunged line clear and pulled your signal, you can then only return the lever to the B position (the normal backlock) until the train has operated the treadle. (In the B position, the arm will be at danger but no interlocking will have released.) The bells would be absolutely standard, unlike the British Rail 'penguin' blocks they didn't physically form part of the block instrument. I can only imagine GER bells, like the Midland variety, could take fast ringing. Working without 'Call Attention' was authorised in the GE inner suburban area, which will have helped things a little - instead of having to go to the bell to receive ILC you just hear your mate bang it in, then he can get on with other things until you get to the instrument to plunge line clear and return the bell code. Gerry Fiennes tells the story of what happened after the grouping, when the new management insisted that as call attention was part of the standard block regs, it should be used around Liverpool Street too. The instruction was rescinded by lunchtime of the first day, after the morning peak ran some 40 minutes late... Remember that, as well as the suburban lines with 24 trains an hour each way, there were the Local and Main lines each with about 15 per hour each way. Those blokes must have earned their money! Log in to reply The following user said thank you: john_s |
| View from the bottom 01/10/2015 at 14:21 #76402 | |
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GMac
71 posts |
The US railway system does operate rather differently to ours (and not just from a signalling standpoint!) As far as infrastructure goes, it's the freight companies that own most of the track, so they get most of the available paths for their trains (as a lot more freight gets carried by rail over there). Outside of the North East Corridor (Amtrak-owned) and the commuter lines around New York, Philly, Boston and Chicago (and to a lesser extent Washington & Baltimore), freight is king and any commuter operators have to pay access charges & fit their trains around them (even Amtrak!). New Jersey Transit & MetroNorth (NYC), SEPTA (Philadelphia), MBTA (Boston) and MARC (Washington & Baltimore) own some/most of their route mileage or have more favourable access agreements than they do in L.A and elsewhere in the country. Think that's due largely to them operating over former Conrail routes, which they took over with regional government backing after said operator divested them in the early eighties. Metra is the only exception, in that it contracts freight operators to run some lines, but it too has regional government support.
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| View from the bottom 03/10/2015 at 11:11 #76478 | |
Steamer
3985 posts |
" said:If you want to have a go with Sykes Lock and Block, the Gloucester Road simulation from Blockpost Software features a simulation of it. The 10-minute free demo will give you the general idea of its operation. "Don't stress/ relax/ let life roll off your backs./ Except for death and paying taxes/ everything in life.../ is only for now." (Avenue Q) Log in to reply |