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| Line blocks / possessions 27/03/2017 at 20:38 #94163 | |
Tange
9 posts |
Have people call you up and ask for line blocks, patrolmans (perhaps with lockout devices on the workstations) and possessions, for a period of time.
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| Line blocks / possessions 27/03/2017 at 22:24 #94166 | |
DriverCurran
688 posts |
See the 15th October 2009 scenarios in Oxted, East Coastway and Edge Hill. :) Paul You have to get a red before you can get any other colour Log in to reply |
| Line blocks / possessions 20/12/2022 at 19:58 #149470 | |
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markymark2000
39 posts |
I'd like to see this more in game rather than selecting a scenario. Firstly there aren't that many scenarios but also, they last all game don't they rather than just for a few hours. Things like a few hour block at a terminus station platform to enable engineers to do some work there. Often some lines are timetabled in a certain way to use less lines to accommodate engineering possessions. Such as on a Sunday I think it is, lines from Slade Lane into Piccadilly are reduced from 4 to 2 and the line closed varies. It's just engineering work and gets released at a certain time. Or a recent issue that I have come across when travelling was a 2 hours emergency engineering possession at Pyle. This could be done in game by engineers requesting permission for a line block, either at a set time or random time. We then block the line, ring the engineer (engineer becomes a phone option) and tell them the line is blocked and work can commence. We can ring the engineer to ask for estimated time of completion. When complete, the engineer rings us to tell us the all people and tools are clear of the line and we can reopen the line. Only lasts a few hours so the whole sim isn't affected. Also means it's more an element of surprise. Log in to reply The following user said thank you: MrSuttonmann |
| Line blocks / possessions 21/12/2022 at 09:54 #149480 | |
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DriverCurran
688 posts |
Mark In the scenario's listed above the PICOP / PICOW will take and give up the possessions that were in force on that day. These do not stay on all day Paul You have to get a red before you can get any other colour Log in to reply |
| Line blocks / possessions 21/12/2022 at 21:42 #149497 | |
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markymark2000
39 posts |
Ahh, thank you. In the scenarios that I have seen and tried, it seemed that things went on all day and it was basically like a major blockade rather than short term blocks.
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| Line blocks / possessions 23/12/2022 at 23:10 #149545 | |
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TUT
532 posts |
markymark2000 in post 149470 said:I'd like to see this more in game rather than selecting a scenario. Firstly there aren't that many scenarios but also, they last all game don't they rather than just for a few hours.It's slightly difficult to know where to begin with this. In real life you have T3 possessions where possession of the line is taken for engineering work. If engineer's trains are involved it has to be done with a T3. These are generally more for your big set piece events, think replacing track, installing/replacing overhead line equipment, the high output ballast cleaner, etc. These are published in the Weekly Operating Notice, or the Supplement to the Weekly Operating Notice if changes have to be made or a possession is arranged at short notice. This is published one week after the WON and on the Thursday (at least everywhere I've worked it's Thursday) of the week before it comes into force. At very short notice an Engineering Notice (or Wire) can be issued. Emergency possessions can be wired out, but at the other end of the scale the bigger possessions can be planned 18 months in advance. Possessions are never a surprise. And if they are taken in emergency you'll already know all about said emergency! Then you've got your line blockages which are for the protection of personnel. "13.1 line blockages" are taken by train crew, station staff, or a "Designated Person" if they need to walk with a group to a train stopped on a running line because of a failure or whatever. Those, yeah, can come as a bit of a surprise. They're certainly not planned out in advance. Your "13.2 line blockages", however, normally are. These are the ones taken by your professional track workers to do inspections, patrolling, work on the track or track-side equipment, crossing the line, etc. etc. And they're pre-planned and sent out to you in advance. They can even appear in the WON, though I've never really known why they sometimes do that. We're not supposed to grant line blockages if we haven't got the details. Unless it's being taken in response to an incident. The bottom line is, though, line blockages and possessions are generally not random, nor unplanned. They can be, but in those instances, they're usually just part of the response to an ongoing incident that you're already dealing with. Now possessions have published times which aren't departed from without good reason. But with line blockages yeah it's a bit different, you get more of a window, which they don't always turn up in. The form might say 1030 to 1100, but that's not necessarily when the phone rings, it's true. But you agree times with them, and it may be that the line blockage is taken and given up and taken and given up. And when they ask for a line blockage you ask how long they need and when they give it up, you ask if they'll need it again. And sometimes you can give them a bit longer if something's running late, and sometimes you have to get them off earlier than you'd originally said (so one of the things you ask them is how much notice they need to give it up) because something might change. So it's a bit different to what your post suggests you may have been imagining, but putting even a simplified version of that in SimSig is really going beyond the capabilities of our little dialogue boxes and drop-down menus. Also, it's not gonna be as much fun as you imagine. We can't delay trains for pre-planned line blockages. So yes, genuinely, line blockage requests do add flavour to the signaller's day, because you've got to find them a margin. But in terms of routing trains around line blockages - you don't really do that. You fit the line block around the trains, definitely not the other way around. So if you want more of a puzzle for playing trains, line blocks aren't really the answer. And then we come to line blockages in response to an incident. It's quite common if you have a big incident in a busy area for a line block to be taken to inspect what's happened and diagnose the fault. And then very often they'll say something like, 'right, this is the problem, we need a 20-minute block to fix it' and there won't be a 20-minute block, especially with the disruption that's already been caused. So instead, it's pretty common to say, right, we'll secure the points in this position, or we'll work around in this way or that, and you can come back at night when it's quiet and we can get you in. So yeah, I think the little possession scenarios we have are a nice touch and a cool little thing, but I wouldn't say there would be much return on investment in trying to implement realistic line blockages in game. If you did want that, I'd say you'd get a lot, lot more value for money with more of a DIY approach. If you want that, I would recommend hosting a sim and playing the COSS (Controller of Site Safety) yourself, and asking for a line block from one of your players and then doing it that way. Cause really line blockages are a lot more about human interaction than normal mode of signalling is. Log in to reply The following user said thank you: Stephen Fulcher |
| Line blocks / possessions 24/12/2022 at 11:51 #149551 | |
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bill_gensheet
1413 posts 
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TUT in post 149545 said:A proportion of these are in the EAS Section 4 and section 5, and most are outside passenger traffic hours. The section 4 are covered explicitly by WTT, while the section 5 are generally 'compatible with WTT', and have notes explaining what to do with affected trains. Additionally as an example at Ilford there is a Wednesdays 'hour or so' around 1100 to inspect the DM in daylight which forces DM trains via the Ilford down flyover avoider (hence Gensheet, BLS etc interest). So as a DIY approach you could print out the relevant 'section 4' and 'section 5' and cut them out for a kind of lucky dip pot. NR original: https://www.networkrail.co.uk/industry-and-commercial/information-for-operators/operational-rules/ Links and indexed: http://www.gensheet.co.uk/ROTR.htm Anglia example: http://www.gensheet.co.uk/EAS2023/AR%20S5.pdf Bill Log in to reply |