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| The West Coast Main Line - Summer 1992 04/02/2019 at 03:27 #115321 | |
officer dibble
409 posts |
Hi all, I was wondering if anyone had definitive train consist information for services operating on the West Coast Main Line during the Summer of 1992? I know that 2+8 HSTs worked to/from Holyhead (& occasionally Manchester) but it is the electric hauled daytime and sleeper services that are of greater interest. I have seen a few photos that show the loco and part of a trains formation and some videos on YT show mixed 9+10 coach formations but these only provide a brief snapshot of the overall operation. I have been trying to locate either loco diagrams or a passenger train marshalling document from the time but so far all searches have proved fruitless. Thanks in advance. When in doubt - Contingency plan 2A. Someone didn't buy the milk - 2A. Someone sneezed at Swansea - 2A. A driver complains the cab is too cold - 2A. Unable to operate a HEx service 4 vice 8 - 2A. Points failure at Ipswich - 2A. Landslip at Pitlochry - 2A Log in to reply |
| The West Coast Main Line - Summer 1992 04/02/2019 at 09:08 #115326 | |
jc92
3690 posts |
I've used a 1986/7 document Pascal provided me. The main difference is most consists (not all) replace the NEX for a DVT. It's amazing how many different sets there were at the time.
"We don't stop camborne wednesdays" Log in to reply |
| The West Coast Main Line - Summer 1992 04/02/2019 at 10:14 #115328 | |
ajax103
1120 posts |
jc92 in post 115326 said:I've used a 1986/7 document Pascal provided me. The main difference is most consists (not all) replace the NEX for a DVT. It's amazing how many different sets there were at the time.Pardon for asking but NEX? Log in to reply |
| The West Coast Main Line - Summer 1992 04/02/2019 at 10:27 #115329 | |
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bnsf734
60 posts |
Its the TOPS code for a Mark 1 Full brake coach. WCML sets had either a full brake or mark 2 air conditioned half brake coach to accomodate the guard. Mark 3 sets had to run with a full brake as the Mark 2 coaches could only run at 100 mph.
Log in to reply The following user said thank you: ajax103 |
| The West Coast Main Line - Summer 1992 04/02/2019 at 11:05 #115330 | |
Meld
1111 posts 
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Paul worth double checking but I'm pretty sure the Blackpools also HST
Passed the age to be doing 'Spoon Feeding' !!! Last edited: 04/02/2019 at 11:05 by Meld Reason: None given Log in to reply |
| The West Coast Main Line - Summer 1992 04/02/2019 at 13:19 #115335 | |
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JamesN
1608 posts |
bnsf734 in post 115329 said:Mark 3 sets had to run with a full brake as the Mark 2 coaches could only run at 100 mph.Mark 1 coaches were also only 100mph; so I doubt that’s the reason... Log in to reply |
| The West Coast Main Line - Summer 1992 04/02/2019 at 13:31 #115337 | |
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Meld
1111 posts
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JamesN in post 115335 said:bnsf734 in post 115329 said:Mark 1s were generally limited to 90mph only rebogied catering and a few others were allowed 100mphMark 3 sets had to run with a full brake as the Mark 2 coaches could only run at 100 mph.Mark 1 coaches were also only 100mph; so I doubt that’s the reason... Passed the age to be doing 'Spoon Feeding' !!! Log in to reply |
| The West Coast Main Line - Summer 1992 04/02/2019 at 13:37 #115338 | |
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jc92
3690 posts |
JamesN in post 115335 said:bnsf734 in post 115329 said:Nothing to do with speed. The full brakes are 100mph cleared same as teh RMBs until the Mk3 resteraunts came online.Mark 3 sets had to run with a full brake as the Mark 2 coaches could only run at 100 mph.Mark 1 coaches were also only 100mph; so I doubt that’s the reason... Incidentally the WTT is a bit misleading as it shows workings that are shown as 110mph stock which are timed for Mk2 sets Incidentally I've checked my platform 5 for 1992 and there are also a number of NHA BGs rated for 110mph running on B4 and commonwealth bogies. "We don't stop camborne wednesdays" Last edited: 04/02/2019 at 14:54 by jc92 Reason: None given Log in to reply |
| The West Coast Main Line - Summer 1992 04/02/2019 at 15:24 #115341 | |
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officer dibble
409 posts |
jc92 in post 115326 said:I've used a 1986/7 document Pascal provided me. The main difference is most consists (not all) replace the NEX for a DVT. It's amazing how many different sets there were at the time.@jc92 - thank you......I believe I have a copy of such a document, I'll take a look. Must have been a headache in train planning when it went wrong to ensure the right sets were on the right route/circuit! Quote: Paul worth double checking but I'm pretty sure the Blackpools also HST@Meld - shown as electric hauled to/from Preston with 47s working to/from Blackpool North. When in doubt - Contingency plan 2A. Someone didn't buy the milk - 2A. Someone sneezed at Swansea - 2A. A driver complains the cab is too cold - 2A. Unable to operate a HEx service 4 vice 8 - 2A. Points failure at Ipswich - 2A. Landslip at Pitlochry - 2A Log in to reply |
| The West Coast Main Line - Summer 1992 04/02/2019 at 16:02 #115345 | |
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jc92
3690 posts |
officer dibble in post 115341 said:jc92 in post 115326 said:Most of the sets had 4-5 day cycles so if it got allocated wrong its stuck that way for the week unless it happens to end up at the same depot overnight. I suspect the real pain would be seat reservations.I've used a 1986/7 document Pascal provided me. The main difference is most consists (not all) replace the NEX for a DVT. It's amazing how many different sets there were at the time.@jc92 - thank you......I believe I have a copy of such a document, I'll take a look. Must have been a headache in train planning when it went wrong to ensure the right sets were on the right route/circuit! The Blackpool and Shrewsbury workings were still Crewe 47/4s, the HSTs were limited to 3 sets working all the Holyhead turns. I think HSTs did make it to Blackpool later on, possibly under Virgin. "We don't stop camborne wednesdays" Log in to reply |
| The West Coast Main Line - Summer 1992 04/02/2019 at 16:36 #115346 | |
postal
5265 posts |
@Officer Dibble Sent an e-mail to your 2006 hotmail telling you where you can source various CWNs (although nothing for 1992 unfortunately). “In life, there is always someone out there, who won’t like you, for whatever reason, don’t let the insecurities in their lives affect yours.” – Rashida Rowe Log in to reply The following user said thank you: officer dibble |
| The West Coast Main Line - Summer 1992 15/02/2019 at 12:32 #115725 | |
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47417
13 posts |
Quote:Most of the sets had 4-5 day cycles so if it got allocated wrong its stuck that way for the week unless it happens to end up at the same depot overnight. I suspect the real pain would be seat reservations.This was not necessarily the case, sets were often swapped at Euston mid-diagram for numerous reasons including: - returning Mk2 & Mk3 sets to booked diagrams to ensure services timed at 110mph had Mk3 vehicles wherever possible and to sort out capacity & seat reservation issues - returning MA based 3FO sets to booked diagrams - getting non-TDM sets onto diagrams finishing at WB/PC/OY/MA so they could attempt to rectify - stock shortage (you could operate the timetable 2 sets short with numerous stepping up moves at Euston) - to meet end of day maintenance requirements ('A' exams mainly) Mk2s ex Oxley worked on 3 day diagrams with an 'A' exam required every 3 days or 2400 miles. Mk3s at other depots worked on 4 day diagrams with an 'A' exam required every 3200 miles. Generally standard formations were as follows: Oxley (OY) DVT - 3 Mk2 FO - RFM - 5 Mk2 TSO Oxley also had two sets that were 2 Mk2 FO Wembley (WB)/Polmadie (PC) DVT - 2 Mk3 FO - RFM - 5 Mk3 TSO Longsight (MA) DVT - 3 Mk3 FO - RFM - 5 Mk3 TSO DVT - 2 Mk3 FO - RFM - 5 Mk3 TSO There were also a small number of Mk3 BFOs in traffic that whilst normally allocated into a set with a DVT making the brake van part of the vehicle redundant, were utilised on occasions to provide a brake van/guards area when a particular set ran non-TDM without a DVT due to DVT shortage. Last edited: 15/02/2019 at 12:48 by 47417 Reason: None given Log in to reply The following user said thank you: officer dibble |
| The West Coast Main Line - Summer 1992 15/02/2019 at 18:03 #115749 | |
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officer dibble
409 posts |
Thanks for that 47417, most useful indeed. That, along with the loco diagrams I have been given should make things much easier when it comes to "allocating" stock in the timetable.
When in doubt - Contingency plan 2A. Someone didn't buy the milk - 2A. Someone sneezed at Swansea - 2A. A driver complains the cab is too cold - 2A. Unable to operate a HEx service 4 vice 8 - 2A. Points failure at Ipswich - 2A. Landslip at Pitlochry - 2A Log in to reply |