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S18 TRTS unfair penalty for seeded train

You are here: Home > Forum > Simulations > Released > Wembley Suburban > S18 TRTS unfair penalty for seeded train

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S18 TRTS unfair penalty for seeded train 31/12/2020 at 14:33 #135703
Dionysusnu
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579 posts 		In the attached timetable, 5M33 seeds at S18, and never gives TRTS. However, a penalty is still incurred.
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Last edited: 31/12/2020 at 14:33 by Dionysusnu
Reason: Forgot to actually attach timetable
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S18 TRTS unfair penalty for seeded train 31/12/2020 at 14:45 #135704
MarkC
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1105 posts 		The issue with the train not giving a TRTS, is a TT error, 5M33 while seeded at S18, Willsden Jn is not in the TT. So as far as the train is concerned he has already left Willsden Jn and he is now waiting at a red signal
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S18 TRTS unfair penalty for seeded train 31/12/2020 at 14:48 #135706
Dionysusnu
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579 posts 		MarkC in post 135704 said:
The issue with the train not giving a TRTS, is a TT error, 5M33 while seeded at S18, Willsden Jn is not in the TT. So as far as the train is concerned he has already left Willsden Jn and he is now waiting at a red signal
That could at the same time be considered a simulation issue for not checking if the train is stopped at the signal. That can happen in some other circumstances too, like abandoning a timetable of a train that is stopped at the station.
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S18 TRTS unfair penalty for seeded train 31/12/2020 at 14:52 #135707
Stephen Fulcher
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2085 posts 		If the sim thinks the train has already passed a location (this issue) or isn’t booked there (abandoned timetable) then why would it TRTS.

Think of it in another way, would the platform staff of any given station press TRTS for a non-stop train or one that they believed had already left?

The train won’t TRTS but will phone in for being sat at the red, so the sim seems to be working fine
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S18 TRTS unfair penalty for seeded train 31/12/2020 at 15:45 #135713
Steamer
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3989 posts 		Stephen Fulcher in post 135707 said:
If the sim thinks the train has already passed a location (this issue) or isn’t booked there (abandoned timetable) then why would it TRTS.

Think of it in another way, would the platform staff of any given station press TRTS for a non-stop train or one that they believed had already left?

The train won’t TRTS but will phone in for being sat at the red, so the sim seems to be working fine
The issue here is that Wembley Sub imposes a penalty for setting a route without first receiving TRTS, to enforce a real-life box instruction.
"Don't stress/ relax/ let life roll off your backs./ Except for death and paying taxes/ everything in life.../ is only for now." (Avenue Q)
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The following user said thank you: Dionysusnu
S18 TRTS unfair penalty for seeded train 01/01/2021 at 16:23 #135818
bfcmik
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100 posts 		When I start a new game I always check all the seeded trains to make sure they have a clear run. You have to let the sim tick a few seconds for all the routes to set but I have caught quite a few trains that needed action taking to enable their movement.

I realise you think the sim should know better, but it doesn't, so you will know what will happen if you run that timetable again - or edit and save the appropriate change into your downloaded version.
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S18 TRTS unfair penalty for seeded train 01/01/2021 at 16:53 #135820
Stephen Fulcher
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2085 posts 		Steamer in post 135713 said:
Stephen Fulcher in post 135707 said:
If the sim thinks the train has already passed a location (this issue) or isn’t booked there (abandoned timetable) then why would it TRTS.

Think of it in another way, would the platform staff of any given station press TRTS for a non-stop train or one that they believed had already left?

The train won’t TRTS but will phone in for being sat at the red, so the sim seems to be working fine
The issue here is that Wembley Sub imposes a penalty for setting a route without first receiving TRTS, to enforce a real-life box instruction.
Sounds like the TT needs altering so that the train either seeds after this signal or has the station as it’s first location.
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S18 TRTS unfair penalty for seeded train 23/01/2021 at 14:33 #136709
Dionysusnu
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579 posts 		Furthermore, I just got a "Route set before TRTS given" penalty, when TRTS was active. Save attached from just after, not sure how much use it is.
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S18 TRTS unfair penalty for seeded train 23/01/2021 at 14:41 #136710
MarkC
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1105 posts 		Dionysusnu in post 136709 said:
Furthermore, I just got a "Route set before TRTS given" penalty, when TRTS was active. Save attached from just after, not sure how much use it is.
Which Train or location is this happening to?
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S18 TRTS unfair penalty for seeded train 23/01/2021 at 14:45 #136711
Dionysusnu
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579 posts 		It's sort of in the post title and in the attached save... Willesden Jn bay P2
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S18 TRTS unfair penalty for seeded train 23/01/2021 at 14:53 #136713
MarkC
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1105 posts 		I ask as there are a number of locations in sim that if a route is set before TRTS is given the penalty also applies and judgeing from what I see in the save you have the route set from Harrow siding's already when the train is not due to leave for another 5 mins which would cause a penalty.

See manual here
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