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| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 27/11/2021 at 11:22 #142494 | |
headshot119
4869 posts |
Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 This thread is for discussion of the Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 timetable. "Passengers for New Lane, should be seated in the rear coach of the train " - Opinions are my own and not those of my employer Log in to reply |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 27/11/2021 at 19:57 #142498 | |
andyallen4014
371 posts |
Started the 2019TT (4am start) and have 3Q13 waiting at a red, signal D1164 but I can't find it. Save attached Post has attachments. Log in to view them. User | Multiplayer Host | Timetable Writer Last edited: 27/11/2021 at 20:02 by andyallen4014 Reason: None given Log in to reply |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 27/11/2021 at 20:00 #142501 | |
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headshot119
4869 posts |
I've opened up your save game and 3Q13 is waiting at D1164 at Adwick Junction. I wonder if you don't have Hamburger>Show>Options>Display>Show All Shunt Signals (Ticked)? Post has attachments. Log in to view them. "Passengers for New Lane, should be seated in the rear coach of the train " - Opinions are my own and not those of my employer Log in to reply The following user said thank you: andyallen4014 |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 27/11/2021 at 20:03 #142503 | |
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andyallen4014
371 posts |
Realised just as you replied it is doing a reversal! I didn't check the number of the shunt signal (hence me looking for the signal diagram). Thanks for the swift reply! User | Multiplayer Host | Timetable Writer Last edited: 27/11/2021 at 20:03 by andyallen4014 Reason: None given Log in to reply The following user said thank you: headshot119 |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 27/11/2021 at 20:55 #142511 | |
9pN1SEAp
1180 posts |
Hi, Should 3Q13 / H32527B seeded at 4am have line codes to indicate which Dn Scun line is to be measured? (Presumably DF) Thanks Jamie Jamie S (JAMS) Last edited: 27/11/2021 at 20:55 by 9pN1SEAp Reason: None given Log in to reply |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 27/11/2021 at 21:00 #142513 | |
GeoffM
6376 posts |
9pN1SEAp in post 142511 said:Hi,There's nothing in the source data for H32527 so I guess it's non-specific for that segment. Some other segments do have line codes but not that bit. SimSig Boss Log in to reply The following user said thank you: 9pN1SEAp |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 28/11/2021 at 13:11 #142548 | |
tjfrancis
359 posts 
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6N12 Has got a class 4 train type Should he be a class 6 train type
I am dyslexic so please consider this when reading my posts Log in to reply |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 28/11/2021 at 13:21 #142549 | |
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9pN1SEAp
1180 posts |
Hi, 1C15 - the acceleration & braking profile of this HST is different from the 125mph sets. The following Class 6 have MXS in excess of 60mph: 6B50 6D00 6D30 6D36 6F72 6M25 6N12 4R01 Drax has max. speed 60mph unlike other services, not sure if deliberate or intentional. Thanks Jamie Jamie S (JAMS) Log in to reply |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 28/11/2021 at 14:21 #142557 | |
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headshot119
4869 posts |
9pN1SEAp in post 142549 said:Hi,1C15 is an East Midlands HST (EMT/EMR not sure when the name changed) they're limited to 110mph. The freights I'm not sure about, I'll wait for one of the timetablers to comment on them. That said it's not unusual in the real world to find a class 6 running at class 4 speeds because someone forgot to adjust the headcode and vice versa. "Passengers for New Lane, should be seated in the rear coach of the train " - Opinions are my own and not those of my employer Log in to reply |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 28/11/2021 at 14:37 #142560 | |
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andyallen4014
371 posts |
headshot119 in post 142557 said:9pN1SEAp in post 142549 said:Was still East Midlands Trains at the time of the TTHi,1C15 is an East Midlands HST (EMT/EMR not sure when the name changed) they're limited to 110mph. User | Multiplayer Host | Timetable Writer Log in to reply |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 28/11/2021 at 19:02 #142573 | |
jc92
3685 posts |
The Drax biomass run 75mph empty and 60mph loaded Incidentally we had an intermodal leave wakefield the other day running at 60pmh under a class 4 headcode as the loco was speed restricted for flats, but remained class 4 as it was intended to swap the loco out later in the journey. "We don't stop camborne wednesdays" Last edited: 28/11/2021 at 19:06 by jc92 Reason: None given Log in to reply |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 28/11/2021 at 19:56 #142582 | |
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Phil-jmw
675 posts |
9pN1SEAp in post 142511 said:Hi,The 3Qxx trains in this TT are all Network Rail Ultrasonic Test Unit (UTU) workings, with some recording up to Max Speed 30mph, some transiting up to max Speed 75mph, and some a mixture of both. I've looked through them all and and while some need no amendment, some need speed and category (rec or transit) amendments, and some also line code insertions. I've listed them all below, in the order they appear in the F4 window sorted by 'Train Identity':- 3Q11/H32518 - No action required. 3Q12/H32521 - No action required. 3Q13/H32527D - Transit max 75 to Thorne Jn, REC max 30 DS Thorne Jn - Kirk Sandall, transit max 75 Kirk Sandall - Doncaster. 3Q13/H32525C - REC max 30 Adwick Jn - Skellow Jn (RM) - Carcroft Jn, transit max 75 Carcroft Jn - Doncaster 3Q13/H32525B - REC max 30 DM/DF/DM throughout. 3Q13/H32527B - REC max 30 DM/DF/DM throughout. 3Q13/H32526B - REC max 30 DM/DF/DM throughout. 3Q13/H32527C - Transit max 75 Doncaster - Kirk Sandall, REC max 30 DS Kirk Sandall - Thorne Jn and DM Thorne Jn - Goole. 3Q13/H32525C - REC max 30 Carcroft Jn - Stainforth Jn, transit Stainforth Jn - Hatfield & Stainforth (RM) - Stainforth Jn, REC max 30 Stainforth Jn - Adwick Jn (RM) - Skellow Jn(RM) - Carcroft Jn, transit max 75 Carcroft Jn - Doncaster. 3Q13/H32527D - REC max 30 Goole - Thorne Jn and DS Thorne Jn - Kirk Sandall, transit max 75 Kirk Sandall - Doncaster. 3Q13/H32526C - No action required. 3Q13/H32525D - No action required. 3Q13/H32527E - No action required. 3Q13/H32526D - No action required. 3Q13/H32525A - REC max 30 UM/UF/UM throughout. 3Q13/H32526A - REC max 30 UM/UF/UM throughout. 3Q13/H32527A - REC max 30 UM/UF/UM throughout. Hope this helps. Regards, Phil. Last edited: 28/11/2021 at 20:13 by Phil-jmw Reason: None given Log in to reply |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 29/11/2021 at 11:42 #142598 | |
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Stanyon
141 posts |
just playing this sim, it seems there's too many freights as in not all will have ran even though there timetabled e.g 3x to goole docks? at least 2 close together to hull docks? I don't remember as many through scunthorpe in 2019 either?
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| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 30/11/2021 at 16:48 #142645 | |
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0D07
91 posts |
Afternoon, 1st of all great work in releasing these sims these are ones that I have been waiting far a long time so thank you. I have noticed a few inconsistencies with the time tables supplied and this has been mentioned in a previous post and suspect this to do with the CIF files supplied for the timetable. Most of the coal traffic from the Humber Ports of Immingham and Hull had a number of duplicate WTT Schedules in the timetable dependent upon where the coal being imported was going that week. That is I reckon the reason why 3 trains from the same port are wanting to go 3 different power stations instead of the one that wanted the coal as per the weekly plan. I know this probably had to simulate unless you have the relevant weekly plans to hand. Could a decision be generated by the sim at random to pick for example 6C41 to run 85% of the time and 6C01 25% and 6B98 to tun 44% of the time say? This would improve things no end. I can't quite remember where trains strike in from the Scunthorpe Direction going to towards Doncaster. I have a feeling its around the Scunthorpe Station area. I watched a train a freight train and struck in 35mph then got gradually faster till it was travelling at the permitted line speed of 55mph. The train a freight service did not slow for the 30mph Heavy Axle Weight (HAW) restriction over Frodingham Viaduct, all freight traffic on that generates RA10 on TOPS has this restriction imposed over them for this section of line and in reality that's all the coal traffic from Immingham and Steel Traffic from Scunthorpe. Nor did this or passenger train that I watched slow for 25/40mph restriction over Keedby Canal Bridge. Like wise coming from Docnaster 4D23 bound for Hull struck in at 72mph! Then slowed to 40mph then raced back up to linespeed. The point work at Docnaster as per the sectional appendix is passed for 25mph unless boarded differently (The end of Platform 4 is a 40mph turn out) I very much doubt a loco unless it was light loco would get to 70+mph from Marshgate Jn to the point its passing D307 signal at Bentley! Coming from Goole again another Heavy Axle Weight Restriction for trains generating over RA9 on TOPS again has 40mph Heavy Axle Weight Restriction imposed from 10m 21ch (Creykes L.C.) to 14m 02ch (Thorne North) Passenger traffic is unaffected by these restrictions. Anything loading over RA on TOPS going to Hull and Goole also has to run at the lower speed from the same Milages. Also for some reason when I went to try and give the keylock release to one of the Doncaster North Crossings the box is just blank! Is there a quick fix to show the keylocks in or out the boxes.? Now to start on my 1999 Doncaster North WTT! Regards, Zero Delta Zero Seven Last edited: 30/11/2021 at 16:51 by 0D07 Reason: None given Log in to reply The following user said thank you: Newhampshires |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 30/11/2021 at 17:43 #142650 | |
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GeoffM
6376 posts |
Thanks for the comments. Some responses below: 0D07 in post 142645 said: I have noticed a few inconsistencies with the time tables supplied and this has been mentioned in a previous post and suspect this to do with the CIF files supplied for the timetable.I'll get MELD to have a look. 0D07 in post 142645 said: I can't quite remember where trains strike in from the Scunthorpe Direction going to towards Doncaster. I have a feeling its around the Scunthorpe Station area.The track strike-in is on [url=https://photos.signalling.org/picture?/877/category/1798-2012_june]G7[/quote]. Looking at the NR open data feed, a TD will initially appear just 25ish seconds before it steps to the next berth. The sim has S303, S305, and S307 showing as the approach berth. 0D07 in post 142645 said: I watched a train a freight train and struck in 35mph then got gradually faster till it was travelling at the permitted line speed of 55mph. The train a freight service did not slow for the 30mph Heavy Axle Weight (HAW) restriction over Frodingham Viaduct, all freight traffic on that generates RA10 on TOPS has this restriction imposed over them for this section of line and in reality that's all the coal traffic from Immingham and Steel Traffic from Scunthorpe. Nor did this or passenger train that I watched slow for 25/40mph restriction over Keedby Canal Bridge.Looks like we did indeed miss the canal speed restriction. However, we can't find any documentation about Frodingham Viaduct (not in the SA where other RAs are mentioned in other areas): where is this information please? 0D07 in post 142645 said: Like wise coming from Docnaster 4D23 bound for Hull struck in at 72mph! Then slowed to 40mph then raced back up to linespeed. The point work at Docnaster as per the sectional appendix is passed for 25mph unless boarded differently (The end of Platform 4 is a 40mph turn out) I very much doubt a loco unless it was light loco would get to 70+mph from Marshgate Jn to the point its passing D307 signal at Bentley!Oops, yes it should entered at a much lower speed. Well spotted. 0D07 in post 142645 said: Coming from Goole again another Heavy Axle Weight Restriction for trains generating over RA9 on TOPS again has 40mph Heavy Axle Weight Restriction imposed from 10m 21ch (Creykes L.C.) to 14m 02ch (Thorne North) Passenger traffic is unaffected by these restrictions. Anything loading over RA on TOPS going to Hull and Goole also has to run at the lower speed from the same Milages.Again, where is this information please? Thanks. SimSig Boss Last edited: 30/11/2021 at 17:53 by GeoffM Reason: None given Log in to reply The following user said thank you: Newhampshires |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 30/11/2021 at 18:58 #142652 | |
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jc92
3685 posts |
Stanyon in post 142598 said:just playing this sim, it seems there's too many freights as in not all will have ran even though there timetabled e.g 3x to goole docks? at least 2 close together to hull docks? I don't remember as many through scunthorpe in 2019 either?Almost certainly the way a CIF works. It shows all trains which are WTT, STP etc for the day in question, but doesn't take account of trains which are either only cancelled or only called up on TRUST manually on the day. As such there'll likely be trains in paths which hardly ever run, or like with the goole, one will normally run, but in one of the three paths depending on customer requirements, the other two will either not be called or will be manually cancelled at origin, but either way, will still go into the CIF. "We don't stop camborne wednesdays" Log in to reply |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 01/12/2021 at 13:41 #142673 | |
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0D07
91 posts |
Afternoon, Thank You for a comprehensive reply and I look forward to seeing the issues highlighted have the minor changes implemented to improve the play-ability. Regarding the Speed Restrictions for the Fright Traffic over various structures and sections of line. I gained this information from Network Rail's RT3973 Heavy Axle Weight Restriction forms. These are issued to traincrew before a train departs a terminal or a yard that is generating RA9 or 10 on the TOPS Computer system. So just about everything from Immingham, Scunthorpe and Hull and certain engineers traffic will be issued with this paperwork. I Have attached a PDF of one of these forms for you to see how I got the information if you require others then drop me a line and I can send you the ones that covers Steel and Petroleum trains but the speed restrictions will be the same for those trains as well and in the same locations. The only reason why it will not be in the Sectional Appendix and this is only and assumption is of the fact that the speeds only apply to a limited number of trains and when a structure is replaced often the HAW restriction is removed. Thanks, Zero Delta Zero Seven Post has attachments. Log in to view them. Log in to reply |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 01/12/2021 at 13:47 #142674 | |
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0D07
91 posts |
Afternoon, I was talking to an old workmate who until a few weeks ago heavily involved with the fleet management of MM;/EMT/EMR HST Set's. The sets had no limiters placed on them and was often hired to GNER/East Coast/VTEC and ran at 125mph regulary and when MML ran the service to Scar'bro when that was diagrammed for a HST its WTT path was Doncaster to York via Temple Hurst and it gave the sets a good work out and got them up to 125mph! The service trains on the Midland Mainline and services that ran through to Leeds was all timed to run at 110mph but the sets had no physical restrictions placed on them. Thanks, Zero Delta Zero Seven Log in to reply |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 01/12/2021 at 18:56 #142688 | |
Meld
1111 posts |
Thanks for the feedback guys. A couple of months back I made some minor changes to the stock set - - merging multiple categories into one, which resulted in about 3000 changes so quite happy that theres only this handful. 2009 & 2019 TTs will be pushed in the next couple of days Passed the age to be doing 'Spoon Feeding' !!! Log in to reply |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 01/12/2021 at 20:27 #142693 | |
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Phil-jmw
675 posts |
Reading back through what I posted about tweaks to the UTU 3Q13 schedules I've spotted a typo:- '3Q13/H32527C - Transit max 75 Doncaster - Kirk Sandall, REC max 30 DS Kirk Sandall - Thorne Jn and DM Thorne Jn - Goole.' should read:- 3Q13/H32527C - Transit max 75 Doncaster - Kirk Sandall, REC max 30 US Kirk Sandall - Thorne Jn and DM Thorne Jn - Goole. Log in to reply |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 02/12/2021 at 12:23 #142710 | |
bugsy
1766 posts
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Whilst playing this timetable I got an 'Internal Error' message and the sim completely froze and I had to shut it down via the Task Manager. Couldn't click on anything in the sim so couldn't get to the technical Info via Hamburger thingy to copy it. So all I can provide is the Error Message screenshot. .....  Edit: Can't remember what I was doing at the time so please don't ask. Post has attachments. Log in to view them. Everything that you make will be useful - providing it's made of chocolate. Last edited: 02/12/2021 at 12:26 by bugsy Reason: added comment Log in to reply |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 05/12/2021 at 19:34 #142777 | |
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headshot119
4869 posts |
I've moved a couple of posts into this thread, as they're not timetabling related.
"Passengers for New Lane, should be seated in the rear coach of the train " - Opinions are my own and not those of my employer Log in to reply |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 19/12/2021 at 11:26 #143009 | |
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Albert
1315 posts |
6D95 is described as a Scunthorpe to Goole train, but enters from Doncaster Station on the Down Leeds. I presume the train gets routed via some circular route to avoid a reversal, but how does it end up on the Leeds line from Scunthorpe?
AJP in games Log in to reply |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 19/12/2021 at 11:40 #143010 | |
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jc92
3685 posts |
Albert in post 143009 said:6D95 is described as a Scunthorpe to Goole train, but enters from Doncaster Station on the Down Leeds. I presume the train gets routed via some circular route to avoid a reversal, but how does it end up on the Leeds line from Scunthorpe?I havent got the sim to hand, but at a guess, its either run via brigg - Gainsborough- doncaster (the big loop you mentioned, albeit with a RR at barnetby) then out via the leeds lines and then it'll run via thorpe Marsh, OR there is a earlier train which enters at scunthorpe and runs through Hatfield to Doncaster Station, running round at Belmont yard before heading back north. "We don't stop camborne wednesdays" Log in to reply |
| Doncaster North SX 2019-01-09 19/12/2021 at 12:44 #143012 | |
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Albert
1315 posts |
Thanks! 6D93 is scheduled to wait until departure time at Hatfield & Stainforth. I routed it in from the fast line to the slow at Stainforth Junction. It blocked the last set of points until I edited it to stop at the near end and shunt forward. AJP in games Log in to reply |