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| East London Line 23/01/2010 at 10:03 #589 | |
Vitesse
31 posts |
Any chance of an east london line sim? Thanks Log in to reply |
| East London Line 23/01/2010 at 10:03 #6094 | |
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Vitesse
31 posts |
Any chance of an east london line sim? Thanks Log in to reply |
| East London Line 23/01/2010 at 10:39 #6095 | |
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TomOF
452 posts |
Definately a good idea but it is one of the simulations that TRE have done
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| East London Line 23/01/2010 at 14:50 #6108 | |
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Vitesse
31 posts |
Dont know?
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| East London Line 23/01/2010 at 15:00 #6110 | |
postal
5265 posts |
Presumably the signallers must have been trained on the new system before test running started. I wonder what training aids they used. JG “In life, there is always someone out there, who won’t like you, for whatever reason, don’t let the insecurities in their lives affect yours.” – Rashida Rowe Log in to reply |
| East London Line 23/01/2010 at 19:04 #6115 | |
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Vitesse
31 posts |
So I assume there's no chance of doing one then?
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| East London Line 23/01/2010 at 20:50 #6116 | |
GeoffM
6376 posts |
Little chance of doing it I'm afraid. The first development when the service runs like the old ELL probably wouldn't be that interesting to simulate. It will become more interesting once through running off the Southern and onto the NLL (and vv) start, in my opinion anyway.
SimSig Boss Log in to reply |
| East London Line 24/01/2010 at 00:48 #6119 | |
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mfcooper
707 posts |
There have been signallers in the 'box using the simulator that is there since at least November. The simulator is (i believe) identical to the real thing, but it allowed signallers to be trained on the fake (:-P) and the contractors to finish on the real. And the auto is called "Automatic Route-setting Facility" - ARF - which as Geoff says, is a simlified ARS relating to junctions only. With any luck, they were planning to start signalling test trains today, but when I spoke to someone on the ELL on Thursday,they was still using the words "hope to". There have already been trains running, but without the signalling equipment operational. It's been a large area of pilotman working (or equivalent). And when they start running trains to and from the Southern and the Northern fringes, then I can see some interesting chaining oppertunities to the NLL and others if they were developed. Here's hoping! Log in to reply |
| East London Line 24/01/2010 at 12:41 #6122 | |
Chrisrail
384 posts |
But if I have the plans from a seperate source ???????
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| East London Line 24/01/2010 at 12:42 #6123 | |
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Javelin395
272 posts |
Apologies for hijacking this thread but I have a related question..... What is the difference in meaning of a conventional subsidiary signal that is showing two steady white lights and the new type of POsA indication mentioned in the first post of this thread? Please bear in mind that [SimSig aside] I am not a signaller nor am I a railwayman in any other capacity. I am just someone that has been fascinated by the railways ever since I was a young lad. Many thanks to anyone that takes the time to explain this for me. Log in to reply |
| East London Line 24/01/2010 at 12:55 #6125 | |
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TomOF
452 posts |
It is designed to tell the driver that theres a fault with the axle counter / track circuit that is preventing from clearing the signal in the normal way and that the signaller wants the driver to pass the signal and proceed at caution ready to stop at any obstruction etc. This is to avoid the train coming to a stop, waiting (normally 2 minutes in most areas but i'm not 100% sure what the default times are at ELL ) to call the signaller and then having the conversation about passing the signal. This is because the headways on ELL are very short with an intensive service and this could cause much more delay. Therefore the driver will see a flashing shunt. To do this the signaller has a special 'POSA' control, and as you can imagine this is only available where POSA signals exist, so you won't see this at York, for instance. Normally a solid shunt aspect with the main signal at danger means that the train is being called onto a line already occupied by another train, or being routed into a siding. Quite common at busy stations. A ground mounted shunt signal allows the driver to proceed ready to stop short of any obstruction. There may or may not be a small indication box telling the driver which line he is signalled for. Log in to reply |
| East London Line 24/01/2010 at 15:05 #6127 | |
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Javelin395
272 posts |
Thanks for your quick reply and a very clear explanation. Although everything you say makes sense I must admit that I still don't quite understand why a new indication is needed. According to the rule book (http://www.rgsonline.co.uk/Rule_Book/Rule%20Book%20Modules/S%20-%20Signals/GERT8000-S1%20Iss%201.pdf) the two solid white lights of a shunt/subsidiary signal authorise a driver to proceed at caution towards the next stop signal or buffer stop whilst being prepared to stop short of any train, vehicle or obstruction. To me this is essentially the same meaning as the new flashing white POSA indication (albeit for different reasons) so why not simply show the usual two solid white lights? Why would the driver need to know the main signal cannot be cleared due to a TCF? Irrespective of the reasons for displaying a shunt aspect he must still proceed at a speed that allows him to stop short of any obstruction. If the 'normal' shunt aspect were displayed upon arrival at the affected signal then no time would be lost due to the requirement to wait for 2 mins before contacting the signaller. In any case, with GSM, NRN and CSR then surely the driver and signaller can have the necessary conversations at any time. Log in to reply |
| East London Line 24/01/2010 at 15:30 #6128 | |
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Javelin395
272 posts |
Just realised the section of the rule book to which I referred previously is for those that need to understand what signals look like and their meaning whereas this module http://www.rgsonline.co.uk/Rule_Book/Rule%20Book%20Modules/S%20-%20Signals/GERT8000-S2%20Iss%201.pdf has more detailed information for drivers and signallers. In the latter module it clearly says that drivers must not pass subsidiary signals unless instructed to do so by a signaller or if entering a permissive platform line. Hence I now see the point of the new POSA indication. I think my confusion has been an excellent example of a little information being dangerous !!! Log in to reply |
| East London Line 24/01/2010 at 16:22 #6129 | |
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Vitesse
31 posts |
Deleted post
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| East London Line 24/01/2010 at 17:02 #6131 | |
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mfcooper
707 posts |
I believe in the Rule Book (somewhere!) it says that a driver should remind the signaller of their presence almost immideately, except where there is a different indication on signage besides the signal, or where they can see the reason (eg: a train still crossing the junction ahead). NB: If you have a Track Circuit or other similar failure, not only will the main signal aspect be held at danger, but the "normal" shunt aspect will also be held at danger. POS aspects can be cleared with a failure ahead of them. Log in to reply The following user said thank you: Javelin395 |
| East London Line 24/01/2010 at 17:47 #6132 | |
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jimgos2005
129 posts |
Wheres all the signalls for the extension going to be controlled from as I havent a clue especially on the extension where the new stations will be located.
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| East London Line 24/01/2010 at 18:24 #6133 | |
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mfcooper
707 posts |
The line from Dalston Junction to just before New Cross Gate/New Cross will be controlled by the new signalling centre at New Cross Gate (NXG) , which I think will also have some controllers from NR/TfL and LOROL in the building. I believe that the extension to Highbury & Islington will also be signalled from here. It is a single WESTCAD workstation for the signaller, and a Signalling Shift Manager with their own workstation to keep an eye on the signaller ;-) Trains that approach New Cross Gate from Surrey Quays will pass into London Bridge's area of control until just passed Sydenham, and then the Crystal Palace trains will pass towards Victoria Central, and West Croydon trains will pass on to Three Bridges. When the extension towards Clapham is built, the trains will pass from NXG (Surrey Canal Road) to London Bridge (at Queen's Road Peckham) to Victoria Eastern (At Denmark Hill) to Wimbledon (near Longhenge Jn) in to Clapham Jn Plat 2. Clapham Junction can only have terminus platforms, so the "Orbital Railway" will always have to enter and exit Clapham Jn platforms from the same end. There is currently only 1 platform in use at Clapham Jn for LOROL services, and I don't think there is room for more. I wonder what they will do... NB: All movements within the Depot at New Cross Gate will be controlled by the signal box. Log in to reply |
| East London Line 24/01/2010 at 18:27 #6134 | |
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jimgos2005
129 posts |
many Thanks as I wasnt aware theres a new signalling centre in the New Cross area apart from that I guess it will remain the same. Many Thanks for the info. Log in to reply |
| East London Line 24/01/2010 at 19:45 #6136 | |
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mfcooper
707 posts |
jimgos2005 said:...apart from that I guess it will remain the same...What will remain the same? As NXG is brand new, there is nothing for it to be the same as! Log in to reply |
| East London Line 24/01/2010 at 19:47 #6137 | |
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jimgos2005
129 posts |
Sorry I didnt make it clear I meant that all the other areas that are not new will still remain in control by the same boxes as they are now.
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| East London Line 24/01/2010 at 20:14 #6138 | |
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Vitesse
31 posts |
I did hear they are looking at the clapham end of the route, there was talk of reinstating platform 1 at Clapham which is out of use and double-tracking the Latchmere Reversible that goes between Clapham Jn and the West London Line
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| East London Line 24/01/2010 at 20:24 #6139 | |
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mfcooper
707 posts |
But the london-end entrance to Clapham Jn has been blocked by porte-cabin offices for the MOM's and some other staff!
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| East London Line 24/01/2010 at 20:38 #6141 | |
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JamesN
1608 posts 
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That's the thing about Porta Cabins... They're Portable :P... I'm sure NR can find somewhere else to put MOMs (Trackside, working, springs to mind)...
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| East London Line 24/01/2010 at 20:47 #6142 | |
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mfcooper
707 posts |
I think there might be an issue with the viaduct edges that the new track would have to pass along also, but who knows!?
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| East London Line 24/01/2010 at 21:26 #6147 | |
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Vitesse
31 posts |
Deleted
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