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Westbury V2.227

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Re: Westbury V2.227 24/08/2011 at 23:24 #20059
Jsun
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Just checked, the shunt won't clear into unoccupied P2. Now tested bang road seems to be held at danger and all shunts refuse to clear.

Also the Up Throwbridge line gives an ACOA as the train reaches the station, I can't say what caused that as I wasn't looking at the panel I was alt+tabbed somewhere else the drivers angry phone call alerted me to the situation.

Last edited: 24/08/2011 at 23:45 by Jsun
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Re: Westbury V2.227 25/08/2011 at 05:25 #20065
Peter Bennet
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" said:
The shunt R479 at Newbury doesn't clear to the Up London, only clears bang road to Reading (haven't check the platforms). I seem to remember it clearing to the up, am I being impatient?

Yes it will if you wait a few moments, it's approach release (probably wrongly but then it must always have been that way) which is TC occupation timed.

" said:

Also the Up Throwbridge line gives an ACOA as the train reaches the station, I can't say what caused that as I wasn't looking at the panel I was alt+tabbed somewhere else the drivers angry phone call alerted me to the situation.

Think I'd need to know more about that before commenting. Given that this is the first report I suspect it was a local matter.

Peter

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Re: Westbury V2.227 25/08/2011 at 05:41 #20067
Jsun
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I've just run from a save before the ACOA, 2O51 on the 1985 TT runs down the throwbridge and gets alarmed at UT6R, UT6 also replaces to danger. It happens when the local reaches Throwbridge, seems to be tied to the train advancing from THR the sim seems to think that the stop signal is swapped around with the repeater. Total stab in the dark but it's the only explanation that UT6 would replace before the train passes.

Additional testing reveals the signal behaves normally on a test TT.

Just submitted a save of the problem under saved simulations "Train approaches inevitable ACOA".

Last edited: 25/08/2011 at 05:56 by Jsun
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Re: Westbury V2.227 25/08/2011 at 09:24 #20071
delticfan
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Hi all, interesting query, can't see any other reference to it so here goes. My first run at Westbury going quite well, if a little busy. Train 5C03 appears, due to arrive Westbury 06.10. Listed as HST but supposed to divide on arrivel (2M80 and 2A03). Can't imagine two halves of an HST. Is it a possible bug as regards train description? Cheers, Mal.
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Re: Westbury V2.227 25/08/2011 at 09:37 #20073
Meld
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Mal just had a quick look at the t/t - 5C03 is a 7 car 158 according to its train type
Passed the age to be doing 'Spoon Feeding' !!!
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Re: Westbury V2.227 25/08/2011 at 09:51 #20075
delticfan
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Hi Meld, just had a look myself and it shows as FGW Class 143 Pacer x 3. Confused.com. I've only got the supplied t/t.
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Re: Westbury V2.227 25/08/2011 at 21:03 #20127
Peter Bennet
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" said:
I've just run from a save before the ACOA, 2O51 on the 1985 TT runs down the throwbridge and gets alarmed at UT6R, UT6 also replaces to danger. It happens when the local reaches Throwbridge, seems to be tied to the train advancing from THR the sim seems to think that the stop signal is swapped around with the repeater. Total stab in the dark but it's the only explanation that UT6 would replace before the train passes.

Additional testing reveals the signal behaves normally on a test TT.

Just submitted a save of the problem under saved simulations "Train approaches inevitable ACOA".
For reasons I can't explain, I can see there is a coding error but it does not explain the fact, the occupation of the TC at S119 is restoring UT6.

Peter

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Re: Westbury V2.227 25/08/2011 at 21:28 #20128
Meld
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Peter In the multiplaw session the other night we found that the circuit for Dn Trowbridge siding wasnt clearing and had to play around in F2 to get a train to reverse - I'm sure Alan will pop along with the actions needed - It was mentioned that the TC may have reverted back to a shorter length,
Passed the age to be doing 'Spoon Feeding' !!!
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Re: Westbury V2.227 25/08/2011 at 21:45 #20129
Peter Bennet
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" said:
Peter In the multiplaw session the other night we found that the circuit for Dn Trowbridge siding wasnt clearing and had to play around in F2 to get a train to reverse - I'm sure Alan will pop along with the actions needed - It was mentioned that the TC may have reverted back to a shorter length,
Yes I will need better explanation of the problem as it looks OK to me.
The siding is not an exit point so the train will never fall off the sim.

Peter

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Re: Westbury V2.227 25/08/2011 at 23:48 #20130
dmaze
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" said:
Also the Up Throwbridge line gives an ACOA as the train reaches the station, I can't say what caused that as I wasn't looking at the panel I was alt+tabbed somewhere else the drivers angry phone call alerted me to the situation.
Track circuit TTDN (on the down Trowbridge line, just before the Waldens LC) trips signal SUT6 (on the up Trowbridge line), which causes any Westbury-bound train stopped at Trowbridge to report the ACOA.

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Re: Westbury V2.227 26/08/2011 at 05:01 #20143
Peter Bennet
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" said:
" said:
Also the Up Throwbridge line gives an ACOA as the train reaches the station, I can't say what caused that as I wasn't looking at the panel I was alt+tabbed somewhere else the drivers angry phone call alerted me to the situation.
Track circuit TTDN (on the down Trowbridge line, just before the Waldens LC) trips signal SUT6 (on the up Trowbridge line), which causes any Westbury-bound train stopped at Trowbridge to report the ACOA.
That's correct, and I know what the coding error was but what I can't figure out was why it was actually causing SUT6 to act the way it was.

Peter

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Re: Westbury V2.227 27/08/2011 at 21:59 #20233
nroberts
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Peter:

I'm getting calls from passenger trains at Trowbridge (UT6) wanting permission to enter Goods Line (it's actually UP Trowbridge). It started at 16:28 with train 1O60. Previous to this I'd had some TCFs in the Westbury station area but at the other end (leading to the Salisbury lines). After 1O60 all passenger trains are calling up requesting permission onto "goods" line. No trains previous to 1O60 called up for this reason.

Maybe this has some bearing on the previous discussions on UT6 resetting (hasn't happened to me yet).

Regards,

Nicholas

P.D. Attached is a save file with 1O92 wanting said permission.

<Edit> I cancelled UT6 to see if it had any bearing on the problem so after answering the ACOA message you should get the request for goods line working </edit>

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Last edited: 27/08/2011 at 22:04 by nroberts
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Re: Westbury V2.227 28/08/2011 at 06:02 #20241
Peter Bennet
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" said:
Peter:

I'm getting calls from passenger trains at Trowbridge (UT6) wanting permission to enter Goods Line (it's actually UP Trowbridge). It started at 16:28 with train 1O60. Previous to this I'd had some TCFs in the Westbury station area but at the other end (leading to the Salisbury lines). After 1O60 all passenger trains are calling up requesting permission onto "goods" line. No trains previous to 1O60 called up for this reason.

Maybe this has some bearing on the previous discussions on UT6 resetting (hasn't happened to me yet).

Regards,

Nicholas

P.D. Attached is a save file with 1O92 wanting said permission.

<Edit> I cancelled UT6 to see if it had any bearing on the problem so after answering the ACOA message you should get the request for goods line working </edit>
I suspect you are right. I can't get the .ssg to work properly as it appears tel calls are not reloaded correctly (separate issue reported) so I never actually get the offending call. But I did get the train on the move OK, through fiddling with f2 and following train ran with no difficulty.

Peter

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Re: Westbury V2.227 28/08/2011 at 16:14 #20264
DrPepperExpress
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" said:
" said:

Simon reports that apparently Greenmill LC keeps flashing failed at every train that is heading towards Bathampton but not the other way, does anyone else get this?
Might happen if you have a really slow train that keeps that barriers down for a while, that's the only thing that will triggers a failure as far as I know.

Peter
Hi Peter,

Since James posted that i've been working on a newer TT for V2.227 of Westbury, and it would seem the crossing failure isn't being cause by anything heading towards Westbury or indeed anything towards the crossing from Bradford Jn. Instead i'm getting crossing failures after EVERY train has DEPARTED BoA towards Bathampton Jn.

Why that would cause a failure i'm not sure, as obviously the crossing is behind you when you leave BoA.

Hopefully i've explained that well enough for you to understand it!

For some good news however, i am LOVING this new version. So much better having to make phone calls to the quarries and yards, and having Westbury's Barrow Crossing keeps things a little more amusing when there isn't much to do.
So thanks for the refreshed version, it has renewed my interest!

And for the record, those of you who've had cows and sheep wanting to cross the BC, i had flock of geese the other night!! :blink:

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Re: Westbury V2.227 28/08/2011 at 17:19 #20269
Peter Bennet
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OK can you confirm whether either of the 2 TCs that are shown as on the crossing are occupied at the time the failure is notified.

What is the length of the train, what is its speed and is it only trains that stop at B on A that do it.

Peter

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Re: Westbury V2.227 28/08/2011 at 17:47 #20274
GeoffM
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" said:
" said:
" said:

2. There are various "MP..." codes around (ie. MP111, MP120, etc). Out of interest, what are these for?
Cheers.
Dave

They were put in by the original developer (Mike or Geoff) probably for interest.
Peter
I believe it is a Group standard/requirement in certain circumstances, so may reflect the real panel.

There are also some discontinuities in the route miles, particularly around Castle Cary.
I put it in to show how long the area of control was. The mileages are as indicated (continuous), not the actual mileposts which, as Andy says, vary.

SimSig Boss
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Re: Westbury V2.227 28/08/2011 at 17:49 #20275
DrPepperExpress
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Neither of the TC are occupied when the failure occurs.

Lengths of train are generally 31, 40, 46 and 69 meters.

Speed at the time of failure is barely moving, the second a train departs the crossing fails, even thoug it shows as in the 'Raised' position.

Trains that Pass BoA do not seem to trigger a fail, so yes only trains that stop at BoA cause a failure.

Hope that helps!

Anything else you want me to try let me know.

Simon.

Last edited: 28/08/2011 at 17:50 by DrPepperExpress
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Re: Westbury V2.227 28/08/2011 at 18:51 #20285
Peter Bennet
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I know what it is, stopping trains are taking over 2 minutes to clear the raise TC which is a fail test.

As I mentioned in another topic, some of the TC lengths are a bit suspect.

Peter

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Re: Westbury V2.227 28/08/2011 at 21:15 #20289
broodje
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Unfortunately I do not have a good picture of the Greenland Mill buttons, there appear to be 2 black push buttons above the track, these could be stop-trough buttons. In the old manual (the manual that came with the first release of the sim) there was a warning that you should not set routes from Bradford on Avon for stopping trains until departure time. The Timings are measured for fast trains.

Peter, do you have the panel pictures? If Geoff is ok with it I can send you them if you haven't got them.

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Re: Westbury V2.227 29/08/2011 at 01:51 #20292
UKTrainMan
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Currently playing Westbury and it appears I've found a bug.

Time is 07:20 and I've got 1A82 on the Up Athelney approaching Signal S47 and only occupying that Track Circuit (which is either TCUJ or TCUJKL - when clicking on it, it comes up as TCUJ but that doesn't show as occupied via F11, but TCUJKL does?!!). I may have cancelled the signal in-front of the driver yet despite getting 120-seconds approach locking I didn't get an ACOA penalty?


Regarding the Greenland Mill LC failing - I had that earlier at 06:11. If it helps, I had Signal 121 set and on auto and I had a train on the Down Trowbridge at the time, which was located beyond the crossing.(solely occupying Track Circuit TTDC1).

Addition: 07:22 - just had it happen again. Everything is exactly as described above. Train is 1V02 and I've got 2V10 just beyond Hawkeridge Junction.


For both of these, the timetable currently in use is Westbury Summer 2007.2.225.2.

Any views and / or opinions expressed by myself are from me personally and do not represent those of any company I either work for or am a consultant for.
Last edited: 29/08/2011 at 02:12 by UKTrainMan
Reason: adding addition

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Re: Westbury V2.227 29/08/2011 at 05:26 #20296
Peter Bennet
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" said:
Currently playing Westbury and it appears I've found a bug.

Time is 07:20 and I've got 1A82 on the Up Athelney approaching Signal S47 and only occupying that Track Circuit (which is either TCUJ or TCUJKL - when clicking on it, it comes up as TCUJ but that doesn't show as occupied via F11, but TCUJKL does?!!). I may have cancelled the signal in-front of the driver yet despite getting 120-seconds approach locking I didn't get an ACOA penalty?

I suspect that at the time you restored S47 the train was far enough away from S47R not to see the aspect change (it's about a 9 mile section).

" said:

Regarding the Greenland Mill LC failing - I had that earlier at 06:11. If it helps, I had Signal 121 set and on auto and I had a train on the Down Trowbridge at the time, which was located beyond the crossing.(solely occupying Track Circuit TTDC1).

Addition: 07:22 - just had it happen again. Everything is exactly as described above. Train is 1V02 and I've got 2V10 just beyond Hawkeridge Junction.
Yes, as I said above, the raise TC (TTDC1) is occupied for more than 2 minutes.

Peter

I identify as half man half biscuit - crumbs!
Last edited: 29/08/2011 at 05:51 by Peter Bennet
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Re: Westbury V2.227 29/08/2011 at 06:05 #20299
Underwood
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" said:
Unfortunately I do not have a good picture of the Greenland Mill buttons, there appear to be 2 black push buttons above the track, these could be stop-trough buttons. In the old manual (the manual that came with the first release of the sim) there was a warning that you should not set routes from Bradford on Avon for stopping trains until departure time. The Timings are measured for fast trains.

Peter, do you have the panel pictures? If Geoff is ok with it I can send you them if you haven't got them.
These are indeed those buttons, one on the left for stopping trains and one on the right is for through trains from what I remember, if not it's the other way round. I don't have a photo of it myself though.

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Re: Westbury V2.227 29/08/2011 at 21:57 #20360
UKTrainMan
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" said:

" said:
Currently playing Westbury and it appears I've found a bug.

Time is 07:20 and I've got 1A82 on the Up Athelney approaching Signal S47 and only occupying that Track Circuit (which is either TCUJ or TCUJKL - when clicking on it, it comes up as TCUJ but that doesn't show as occupied via F11, but TCUJKL does?!!). I may have cancelled the signal in-front of the driver yet despite getting 120-seconds approach locking I didn't get an ACOA penalty?

I suspect that at the time you restored S47 the train was far enough away from S47R not to see the aspect change (it's about a 9 mile section).
Interesting. When I looked on Google maps, although I could not identify the actual signal location, I did note the line approaching the station is quite straight.

Any views and / or opinions expressed by myself are from me personally and do not represent those of any company I either work for or am a consultant for.
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Re: Westbury V2.227 30/08/2011 at 05:32 #20364
Stephen Fulcher
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" said:
" said:

" said:
Currently playing Westbury and it appears I've found a bug.

Time is 07:20 and I've got 1A82 on the Up Athelney approaching Signal S47 and only occupying that Track Circuit (which is either TCUJ or TCUJKL - when clicking on it, it comes up as TCUJ but that doesn't show as occupied via F11, but TCUJKL does?!!). I may have cancelled the signal in-front of the driver yet despite getting 120-seconds approach locking I didn't get an ACOA penalty?

I suspect that at the time you restored S47 the train was far enough away from S47R not to see the aspect change (it's about a 9 mile section).
Interesting. When I looked on Google maps, although I could not identify the actual signal location, I did note the line approaching the station is quite straight.
Would the route need to time out if the driver could not possibly have seen the signal off?

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Re: Westbury V2.227 30/08/2011 at 07:35 #20366
Peter Bennet
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Timing out is a mechanical function of the interlocking, it does not know where the trains is. The receipt of an ACOA is a matter of ophthalmic fact, either you see it or you do not. Assuming a straight, level track following the curvature of the earth and assuming the height of the signal head is 12' and the driver is sat 12' above the track then the sighting distance is around 6 miles. Now assuming he was 6 miles away from the signal do you think he could pick it out let alone distinguish the aspect?

Peter

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