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| CE524 at Gretna Jn (and other issues!) 18/11/2012 at 00:58 #37610 | |
Danny252
1461 posts |
As far as I can see, CE524 should clear if CE509 is clear (i.e. a route set towards C504). However, even with 509 clear, 524 is still approach held. Why is this? Every other pair of RR signals clear when a route is set from the "front" one (e.g. 508/521 on the Down). Additionally, it should show a single yellow if an approach released route is set from the signal in advance (509 to 505, compare with 521 to 526 on the down) (Also, why are 501/502/504/505 plated C, not CE?) And for a few other odd things I've noticed but aren't worthy of a new thread each: There's a hash (#) symbol in the middle of Upperby Bridge Junction, unless it has some unexplained meaning. All of the "flat crossing" symbols (e.g. Down Newcastle/Up Midland crossing at Petteril Bridge Jn, all 3 corners of Bog and Roman St Jns) display incorrectly when a route is set over them/a train is on them - they show the whole symbol, rather than just the symbol for the route set over them. The non-TC'd track and A--A markers are also non-standard, but I guess that one's just preference. Definitely a preference one - could the length label for the Plumpton UGL be moved? For some reason I had a really hard time noticing it where it is, and it looks a bit odd where it is, floating in the middle of nothingness. Perhaps it would look better swapped with the Plumpton label, to match the labels at Eden Vale? There's something funny with the approach berths from Carnforth if you get a lot of trains in quick succession. I had 3 arrive right after eachother - 4S53, 4S64 and 4S55. 53 picked up 64's TD, 64 picked up 55's TD, and 55 was left blank (I figured something was up when "4S64" claimed it was stopped at CE3, despite being past CE6, followed by "4S55" seemingly splitting...) Last edited: 19/11/2012 at 00:23 by Danny252 Log in to reply The following user said thank you: TomOF |
| CE524 at Gretna Jn 18/11/2012 at 10:28 #37622 | |
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TomOF
452 posts |
" said:As far as I can see, CE524 should clear if CE509 is clear (i.e. a route set towards C504). However, even with 509 clear, 524 is still approach held. Why is this? Every other pair of RR signals clear when a route is set from the "front" one (e.g. 508/521 on the Down). Additionally, it should show a single yellow if an approach released route is set from the signal in advance (509 to 505, compare with 521 to 526 on the down) Thanks for spotting this. " said:
The reason that some signals are plated 'C' is that there are two parallel layouts around Floriston that are mutually exclusive depending on which era you run, owing to the fact that the LC type is different and CE501/2 change from Auto to controlled. It was easier to define two sets of signals with different names. " said:
These denote switch diamonds. This is a standard symbol in use on Network Rail's own workstations " said:
This is in fact a newer standard. " said: That's something else we hadn't seen during testing. I guess we might find a few more bugs like this as time goes by because testing concentrated more on there not being trains stacking up in places due to infrastructure failures, that kind of thing. Having retested based on your comments I can confirm that this can be a problem. Again, thanks for bringing that to my attention Last edited: 18/11/2012 at 10:30 by TomOF Log in to reply |
| CE524 at Gretna Jn 18/11/2012 at 11:38 #37631 | |
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TomOF
452 posts |
PS: The issue with CE524 being wrongly approach controlled is only an issue in 80s mode when running with conditional aspects. Just pretend there's a track defect and the techies have put temporary approach control on... 
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| CE524 at Gretna Jn 18/11/2012 at 12:14 #37633 | |
moonraker
370 posts |
I find that if CE524 is cleared early enough it will in fact show a green aspect across Floriston once the barriers are down and the clear button is pressed.
Last edited: 18/11/2012 at 12:15 by moonraker Log in to reply |
| CE524 at Gretna Jn 18/11/2012 at 13:35 #37648 | |
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Danny252
1461 posts |
Quote:
Makes a surprising amount of sense, given how much confusion switch diamonds have given elsewhere. " said:
This is in fact a newer standard.[/quote] Really? Wonder why that was decided. It looks really odd, as (I think?) it's the only symbol where anything but the actual route shows up in red during normal running (as compared to flooding the TC) Quote: " said:It wasn't even an infrastructure failure - the trains just kept appearing! I've had a few moments like that on the 80s TT (I also had 4 or 5 in a row all out of Kingmoor, all on time), I wonder if some of the timings need tweaking.That's something else we hadn't seen during testing. I guess we might find a few more bugs like this as time goes by because testing concentrated more on there not being trains stacking up in places due to infrastructure failures, that kind of thing. Having retested based on your comments I can confirm that this can be a problem. Again, thanks for bringing that to my attention One other small thing was that I was wondering about the length of the Down Slow at Penrith - is it suitably long that you can assume any train will be able to fit inside and clear at both the signals? Log in to reply |
| CE524 at Gretna Jn 18/11/2012 at 16:53 #37661 | |
postal
5265 posts |
" said:I've had a few moments like that on the 80s TT (I also had 4 or 5 in a row all out of Kingmoor, all on time), I wonder if some of the timings need tweaking.Timings are as per WTT; the notes to the TT explain that there are conflicts but these are caused by faithfully transcribing the data from the original source material. If there is a conflict, the SimSig signaller has to manage as best he/she can, just like when the real signaller was trying to work to the printed WTT. " said: One other small thing was that I was wondering about the length of the Down Slow at Penrith - is it suitably long that you can assume any train will be able to fit inside and clear at both the signals?Looking at Table A to the Sectional Appendix, the loop runs from 50m 14ch to 51m 30ch so there is over a mile to play with. CE188 is 28 chains (560 metres give or take) from Penrith Sth. Jn. “In life, there is always someone out there, who won’t like you, for whatever reason, don’t let the insecurities in their lives affect yours.” – Rashida Rowe Last edited: 18/11/2012 at 16:53 by postal Log in to reply |
| CE524 at Gretna Jn 18/11/2012 at 17:44 #37663 | |
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Ben86
126 posts |
" said:The loop is certainly long- I routed a class 185 into platform 3 to allow a late running 390 to pass on the Down Main. However, there seemed to be a 10mph speed limit on the Down Slow, so I ended up delaying my 185 by 7 minutes or so! That would actually be consistent with the figures Postal quoted above. Log in to reply |
| CE524 at Gretna Jn (and other issues!) 19/11/2012 at 00:48 #37689 | |
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Danny252
1461 posts |
Three more I picked up on - all 1980s/conditional aspects: CE489 on the Up near Kingmoor was, for some reason, held at red with CE483 showing green (RR applies here). Resetting the route from 483 fixed this issue, but I have no idea what caused it - it behaves perfectly well most of the time. CE272 on the Down at Upperby Jn isn't behaving quite right some of the time. As I see it, the aspect sequences should be: 264 no route - 264 R, 261 Y, 258 YY 264 to 272 set, 272 no route - 272 R, 264 R, 261 Y, 258 YY (as 272 has RR, 264 won't clear) 264 to 272 set, 272 to 286 set, 286 no route - 286 R, 272 Y, 264 YY, 261 YY, 258 G (YYA applies) Route set through all - normal aspects However, in the 3rd case (route set as far as 286 but not further), I am sometimes getting the sequence 286 R, 272 R, 264 Y, 261 YY, 258 Y - i.e. 272 is not clearing, despite having a route set, and no RR/RA applying. It seems to be that it works when the sim starts, but something causes this behaviour to become default. I've attached a save showing the issue, and a save from about a minute before. Lastly, there's an issue with the TC(s) between 527 and 525 on the Up Dumfries Single. When a train occupies it, it splits into three - I actually suspect it should be shown as three separate TCs in the 1980s mode, but it's getting confused and showing only the one TC from the 2000s mode normally (when the points were gone and its just plain track (the layout is "simplified" to plain double track in the 2000s mode). Attached a save for this one too. Post has attachments. Log in to view them. Last edited: 19/11/2012 at 00:49 by Danny252 Log in to reply |
| CE524 at Gretna Jn 19/11/2012 at 15:01 #37722 | |
jc92
3687 posts 
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" said:" said:to add to that, the down loop has a painfully low speed limit (around 20-25mph IIRC)there was a section that appeared briefly on the wiki explaining the perils of penrith loop, but it seems to have disapeared.The loop is certainly long- I routed a class 185 into platform 3 to allow a late running 390 to pass on the Down Main. However, there seemed to be a 10mph speed limit on the Down Slow, so I ended up delaying my 185 by 7 minutes or so! That would actually be consistent with the figures Postal quoted above. "We don't stop camborne wednesdays" Log in to reply |
| CE524 at Gretna Jn 19/11/2012 at 15:53 #37726 | |
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postal
5265 posts |
" said:to add to that, the down loop has a painfully low speed limit (around 20-25mph IIRC)there was a section that appeared briefly on the wiki explaining the perils of penrith loop, but it seems to have disapeared.25mph over the turnout into the loop then 10mph all the way down the loop - there is a warning about it in the crib sheet that accompanies the TT which is maybe where you've seen it, “In life, there is always someone out there, who won’t like you, for whatever reason, don’t let the insecurities in their lives affect yours.” – Rashida Rowe Log in to reply The following user said thank you: jc92 |
| CE524 at Gretna Jn 19/11/2012 at 17:06 #37737 | |
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Jan
906 posts |
Although in real life it's now 25 mph until you get into the vicinity of the fast line platforms, where the speed then drops to 10 mph. I don't know when that change went through, although it's already shown that way in the baseline declaration dated from 16/11/08. But that obviously doesn't help you in the sim 
Two million people attempt to use Birmingham's magnificent rail network every year, with just over a million of them managing to get further than Smethwick. Log in to reply The following user said thank you: postal |
| CE524 at Gretna Jn 25/11/2012 at 19:01 #38110 | |
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Jan
906 posts |
Come to think of it, as the 2000s mode includes the redoubled section towards Dumfries, which was completed in August 2008, it ought to include the speed improvement on the Down Slow at Penrith as well. In the meantime though, I'll just have to pretend it's a slightly annoying TSR... B)
Two million people attempt to use Birmingham's magnificent rail network every year, with just over a million of them managing to get further than Smethwick. Log in to reply |