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| Awkward sidings 02/01/2013 at 13:34 #39984 | |
clive
2789 posts |
I'm looking for examples of sets of sidings (not single sidings) or yards where the *only* access involved crossing a running line over a diamond crossing. The only one I've found so far is Boiler Shop Sidings at Brighton (see kbarber's recent posting), but I thought it was a reasonably common arrangement. Bonus points if the layout is still there today. Log in to reply |
| Awkward sidings 02/01/2013 at 13:53 #39985 | |
moonraker
370 posts |
When I was still an Oxford Driver I always felt that the up and down carriage sidings were awkward to get across to from one to the other. Arrivals on the downside sometimes stayed in the DCS until near departure time but some stabled in the UCS awaiting a later working and you then have to cross all the running lines to plat 3 usually and then in to the UCS. When things got busy it could be a bit of a headache for Oxford Panel at times
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| Awkward sidings 02/01/2013 at 14:35 #39986 | |
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Late Turn
699 posts |
Clive, The quarry sidings at Bardon Hill are accessed in the way you describe, worked from a ground frame released by Bardon Hill box. The box diagram can be seen here - the quarry sidings lead off above the single Up Siding (which does have a trailing connection back into the Up Goods). Incidentally, the arrangement at the single 'Tarmac siding' to the right of that photo shows the more common arrangement, using a single slip instead to incorporate a trailing crossover between the running lines too. Another example, once upon a time, was Loughborough South (on the former GC main line), where a trailing connection in the Down Main led across the Up Main and to the brickworks. Tom Log in to reply |
| Awkward sidings 02/01/2013 at 14:47 #39987 | |
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kbarber
1742 posts |
" said:I'm looking for examples of sets of sidings (not single sidings) or yards where the *only* access involved crossing a running line over a diamond crossing. The only one I've found so far is Boiler Shop Sidings at Brighton (see kbarber's recent posting), but I thought it was a reasonably common arrangement. If you include a diamond with a slip (as in the Boiler Shop Sdgs example), it was indeed common - if you have access to the Swift diagrams published by SRS, there's plenty on the Midland section (Loughborough alone had five and Sileby had one where sidings on the up side were accessed from both the down passenger and the down goods via a single connection with diamonds in the up pass, down goods and up goods). I'm fairly certain some stations on the Hertford Loop used to have a similar arrangement, with a goods loop accessed at one end by a trailing connection from the nearest running line and at t'other through a diamond from a trailing connection in the further running line; I'm fairly certain those examples also had a slip on the diamond to create a trailing crossover. In fact, taking a closer look at Brighton, there's a Sileby-like connection at the London end of Upper Goods, between No.1 Up Siding and No.1 Goods Siding (albeit with a double slip in the down local giving facing access to No.1 Goods); there's also a true diamond (no slips at all) in the station area from Platform 2 to Engine Shed West. I can't think whether the Settle & Carlisle had anywhere with such a layout; if it did, that would be a place you might still hope to find it extant (though whether still in use would be a very different matter). I suspect it's a configuration that's fallen out of favour in recent years, with the move away from diamond crossings (and even more so slip connections) wherever practicable, but would've been common hitherto as it avoided the facing points the BoT was so wary of. Edited to add: The usual layout for signalling purposes would have a crossover formed by the trailing points and the slip end in the opposite running line (two ends worked by one lever) and the connection into the sidings would then be the slip end in the crossover road and the siding end points (again two ends worked off one lever). On the box diagram (certainly the LM style "straight-line" diagrams) it would look like the Tarmac Siding connection in the link posted by Late Turn. Last edited: 02/01/2013 at 15:25 by kbarber Reason: Further thoughts Log in to reply |
| Awkward sidings 02/01/2013 at 15:01 #39989 | |
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Danny252
1461 posts |
If you go with only via a diamond, then I think you're not going to find much. Plenty of locations with a trailing crossover to the "near" line at one end, and one with a diamond over the "near" line to the "far" line at the other end, though. But one for your list, Arley used to have this arrangement - the sidings connected to the Down Loop with a diamond over the Up and Down Main, but with no connection to them, hence why the Down Starting is short of the fouling point now. Log in to reply |
| Awkward sidings 02/01/2013 at 17:18 #40003 | |
GeoffM
6376 posts |
" said:I'm looking for examples of sets of sidings (not single sidings) or yards where the *only* access involved crossing a running line over a diamond crossing. The only one I've found so far is Boiler Shop Sidings at Brighton (see kbarber's recent posting), but I thought it was a reasonably common arrangement.Victoria station in London: http://goo.gl/maps/A7pdG The Up Carriage Sidings are accessed by crossing the Brighton Reversible - they're not accessible from the latter. SimSig Boss Log in to reply |
| Awkward sidings 02/01/2013 at 18:04 #40006 | |
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GeoffM
6376 posts |
Neasden Jn's Freight Terminal - accessed from the Down Main after turning left at Neasden Jn from Marylebone, crossing the Up Main, and into the sidings.
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| Awkward sidings 02/01/2013 at 18:11 #40008 | |
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GeoffM
6376 posts |
Bedworth Murco Petroleum between Coventry and Nuneaton - not sure if it survived the resignalling. Only accessible from the Up Coventry, crossing the Down Coventry.
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| Awkward sidings 02/01/2013 at 18:38 #40009 | |
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Signalhunter
177 posts |
The most awkward one that I ever saw a picture of was (I think) somewhere in Hertfordshire, possibly a single line. The siding was to the left but, was accessed via a R.H. point! After a curve to the right, it then curved back to the left and crossed the running line via a simple diamond (No slip roads.) Memory suggests that the picture was in an article on trackwork, in the old Modeller's BackTrack magazine. Log in to reply |
| Awkward sidings 02/01/2013 at 19:25 #40012 | |
jc92
3685 posts |
as can be seen on this diagram:http://www.lymmobservatory.net/railways/sbdiagrams/bxj0b_q45.jpg(courtesy of lymms observatory) barnsley exchange Jcn had one of these. the coal yard/loco shed was accessable from the down main only via a single slip, hence anything from the up direction would require a reversal at 39 signal.
"We don't stop camborne wednesdays" Log in to reply |
| Awkward sidings 02/01/2013 at 20:55 #40016 | |
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TomOF
452 posts |
Doughty Road power station in Grimsby had a siding which crossed the up and down main running lines on the East Lincs on flat crossings after having to reverse on the up goods. There was no other access as far as I know. There is no trace of this today, and even when the trackbed was still present I never managed to trace the exact spot. http://www.signalbox.org/diagrams.php?id=384 Log in to reply |
| Awkward sidings 04/01/2013 at 00:42 #40137 | |
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Hooverman
306 posts |
Salfords Sidings between Gatwick Airport and Redhill have a trailing connection from the Down Slow Line in the up direction over a fixed diamond on the Up Slow line to gain access. Last used for topsoil trains going to the Olympic Park.
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| Awkward sidings 04/01/2013 at 13:30 #40158 | |
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clive
2789 posts |
Thanks for all these answers. In case it wasn't clear, I wasn't interested in arrangements where there's a diamond at one end but a trailing crossover to the nearest line at the other; they used to be pretty common. Keith: a quick trawl through Quail doesn't find any on the S&C. Geoff: the Victoria one was wonderful - exactly what I wanted. Thanks particularly for that. Log in to reply |
| Awkward sidings 12/01/2013 at 23:04 #40501 | |
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john_s
31 posts |
Some more suggestions from my web pages - Wadsley Bridge - only access to Messrs Batchelors siding is from the down main, crossing the up main: http://www.lymmobservatory.net/railways/sbdiagrams/wadsley_bridge_q50.jpg Barnsley Junction - only access to the No1 and No2 Up Sheffield Sidings crosses the down and up branch lines http://www.lymmobservatory.net/railways/sbdiagrams/barnsley_junction.jpg and - perhaps closest to the original enquiry, look at the access to the shed in these Hammerton Street diagrams: http://www.lymmobservatory.net/railways/sbdiagrams/hammerton_street_1953_q50.jpg http://www.lymmobservatory.net/railways/sbdiagrams/hammerton_street_70_q50.jpg regards, John Log in to reply |
| Awkward sidings 13/01/2013 at 06:56 #40506 | |
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mfcooper
707 posts |
" said:Geoff: the Victoria one was wonderful - exactly what I wanted. Thanks particularly for that.But it's not what we want in the box. It's a pain in the backside! Log in to reply |
| Awkward sidings 13/01/2013 at 11:56 #40514 | |
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CAP.
24 posts |
Here's an example from Kesteren (Ktr) Holland. I just thought about this one while reading the topic. http://www.sporenplan.nl/html_nl/sporenplan/ns/ns_nummer/gdm-est.html (scroll to the right) http://goo.gl/maps/748Hb The area was resignalled and track layout was simplified around 25 years ago. The diamond crossing is at the east side of the train station and before resignalling the sidings were directly accessible at this place from the mainlines. Nowadays they are only accesible from the west side of the train station. Log in to reply |
