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| britains busiest signal box? 24/06/2014 at 17:03 #61985 | |
jc92
3687 posts |
The NRM appear to have branded Borough Market Junction as Britain's busiest signal box in all recent communications, but I can't help but think that they have got things wrong and exaggerated things (again?). I thought I'd open this thread up with the intention of seeing whether anyone can beat it! so how about: 1) Busiest Box in relation to movements within a 24hr period 2) Busiest Box in relation to movements per hour (BMJ had 89 between 17:00 and 18:00 according to WBS frame) candidates have to be UK based. I am excluding large power boxes such as Three Bridges, Kings Cross, West Hampstead, However all Mechanical, power Frame, slide frame and smaller Panel boxes can be nominated. "We don't stop camborne wednesdays" Last edited: 24/06/2014 at 17:04 by jc92 Log in to reply |
| britains busiest signal box? 24/06/2014 at 17:50 #61987 | |
madaboutrains
316 posts |
I would say London Bridge.
RIP Feltham Panel 1 Log in to reply |
| britains busiest signal box? 24/06/2014 at 17:52 #61988 | |
bugali
78 posts |
i think it might be London bridge Power frame. it would have the same amount of trains as BMJ but it would have all the trains on the Brighton platform Ali Log in to reply |
| britains busiest signal box? 24/06/2014 at 17:53 #61989 | |
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Superpicop
11 posts |
Wimbledon i think someone told me when i was on a visit there?
Last edited: 24/06/2014 at 17:54 by Superpicop Log in to reply |
| britains busiest signal box? 24/06/2014 at 18:06 #61990 | |
GeoffM
6376 posts |
"Busiest" is rather vague which probably allows the NRM to determine what they want the definition to be to match the situation they want it to apply to. So is busiest in terms of the number of discrete actions a single signaller makes? Or number of train movements per hour per box? But what if it's busy but everything passes through with minimal actual actions? Or a very busy signaller but not so many train movements? Very subjective! SimSig Boss Log in to reply |
| britains busiest signal box? 24/06/2014 at 18:15 #61991 | |
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jc92
3687 posts |
" said:"Busiest" is rather vague which probably allows the NRM to determine what they want the definition to be to match the situation they want it to apply to.Agreed. I have tried to reduce the subjectivity by Stating Movements (train not lever) per hour. this appears to be the museums Logic behind it as well. "We don't stop camborne wednesdays" Log in to reply |
| britains busiest signal box? 24/06/2014 at 18:32 #61992 | |
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clive
2789 posts |
What about Liverpool Street with the Jazz services going in and out and doing loco changes as well?
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| britains busiest signal box? 24/06/2014 at 18:54 #61994 | |
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valenta43002
43 posts |
New street especially when something goes wrong
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| britains busiest signal box? 24/06/2014 at 21:33 #61999 | |
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kbarber
1742 posts |
" said:What about Liverpool Street with the Jazz services going in and out and doing loco changes as well? I'd put a word in for Liverpool St too, though - again - with the proviso that we're looking at steam working on the West Side. Once electric traction took over things went a little quieter, of course. If we're talking about the 1949 panel boxes, Bethnal Green worked the same traffic Liverpool St did with only one signalman whereas LV had three (until the Jazz service was thinned after the Victoria Line opened). At the time the Jazz was launched (1920), the boxes at Bethnal Green were reckoned to handle over 100 trains per hour in total during the peaks. This with mechanical signalling and Sykes Lock & Block! (The work at Liverpool St was split between two boxes and there were no boxes between there and BG that worked all three pairs of lines.) I believe Wimbledon A was the busiest mechanical frame in recent times but I couldn't say what its actual workload was. Clapham A, West London Junction, Queenstown Road and Waterloo must have had a claim on the 'busiest' title, although Clapham and Waterloo were multiple-manned and West London Jc could be left to run auto except for occasional crossing moves. Certainly Waterloo in the peak had something like a train every 40sec, which equates to 90 per hour. Ali is right about the 1928 London Bridge box, of course, and on that basis the NRM is clearly talking nonsense. But with over 300 levers and (again) several signalmen the working would seem less intense. So are they working on number of trains per hour per signalman, perhaps? Do we include London UndergrounD boxes? If so, the former Aldgate box must surely be a contender with one signalman working the whole of the Aldgate triangle. If we start including light engine and ecs movements in the station throat, Euston in the decade after 1974 must be a contender. I'm sure there's others I've forgotten. What the NRM don't seem to be claiming - but I think it would be a valid claim - is BMJ as the busiest box on the basis of the intensity of each signalman's work (which would start with lever movements but needs to allow for regulating decisions & such too). Sad that such a prestigious organisation can get something that basic so very wrong. Log in to reply |
| britains busiest signal box? 24/06/2014 at 22:19 #62002 | |
ozrail
197 posts |
In the Guinness book of Rail facts and feats published 1981 states that Motherwell is the largest area, Trent has the most trains on the panel at one time and London Bridge is the busiest. It also mentions London Victoria as being the largest signal box when completed in 1983. As an outsider I would say London Bridge is the busiest. I remember reading somewhere that before resignalling Metropolitan Junction was the busiest flat junction in the world. Anyway, the old joke was that every Signaller thought he worked in that hardest signal box, but I think London Signallers spend more time pushing buttons then anywhere else.
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| britains busiest signal box? 25/06/2014 at 00:08 #62005 | |
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tbh183
24 posts |
When I worked at London Bridge (early 2000s) - it was the 2nd busiest box in the country after Wimbledon and then only be less than a half dozen trains!
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| britains busiest signal box? 12/09/2014 at 08:43 #64534 | |
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MrBitsy
121 posts |
i would agree each signaller will think his panel is the busiest! At West Hampstead our panel three never drops below 13 trains on the panel. In rush hours it averages 18 trains. dealing with that number of trains plus Radlett jcn, Harpenden jcn, St.Albans & Luton terminators makes for a busy panel. A box may have a panel with more trains but mostly straight running. Our panel two has less trains on it at any one time but only covers a few miles so it can feel busy. TVSC Link 4 signaller - Temple Meads, Bath & Stoke Gifford Log in to reply |
| britains busiest signal box? 12/09/2014 at 23:32 #64548 | |
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ozrail
197 posts |
I agree. Any panel that your constantly crossing trains over is busier. And don't forget about the telephone work. I prefer a panel with more trains and then one with more telephone calls.
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| britains busiest signal box? 13/09/2014 at 19:18 #64559 | |
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jimgos2005
129 posts |
I think that the London area with its various boxes has the most trains but then again you can not forget Birmingham New Street also Manchester Piccadilly these are just my ideas but this does make for a good SimSig subject to talk about. I never realised that West Hampstead was so busy as I am looking at the areas from a passenger point of view also I say the same about Wimbledon apart from Waterloo Station panel. Log in to reply |
| britains busiest signal box? 04/12/2014 at 17:18 #66126 | |
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Essexgirl
42 posts |
If we are talking modern, then Leeds West Workstation in York IECC is, without the aide of ARS, ridiculously busy. 5 approach routes (all double track) feeding into 6 bi-di approach roads to Leeds Station (have to select correct approach line based on which platform required at Leeds stn, which is controlled by Leeds East Workstation), add to this the Yards at Stourton and Hunslet and associated Loco movements between the yards and Midland Rd, you can soon start racking those delays up, especially if you have a Line Blockage and therefore have to turn off the associated ARS subarea and work manually, and that's all before you get all the set swops being done by Northern in the station, and the poorly planned station workings/ARS programming
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