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Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 25/07/2024 at 18:46 #157918 | |
jc92
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This timetable has now been uploaded pending approval. Feel free to use this thread to report any issues. OVERVIEW Welcome to Doncaster in the Summer of 1981 Doncaster PSB is now fully commissioned, although it hasn't yet had its official opening ceremony. The ECML has almost completed its modernisation towards full power signalling and high speed Operation. Express passenger services are now in the hands of HST/class 254 sets working to Scotland, Newcastle, Middlesborough, Leeds, Bradford, Harrogate & Hull. Deltics are living out their final days on secondary work. They predominantly cover Semi fast services between York and Kings Cross, the loco hauled services from Kings Cross to Cleethorpes and Transpennine services to Liverpool. There is also a healthy procession of overnight Sleeper, Motorail and parcels traffic worked by 31s, 55s, 40s 46s and 47s. There is some shunting overnight but most of this was done at Peterborough & York during this period. A Transpennine service is offered from Manchester Piccadilly to Hull & Cleethorpes utilising class 123 and 124 DMUs. These were used interchangably including being mixed within sets but have been shown as class 124s in the timetable for simplicity. Local Services are offered between Doncaster and Sheffield, York, Leeds, Cleethorpes, Hull & Lincoln using various first generation DMUs. The days of consistent clockface timetables are some way off and users will find these services less frequent and consistent than we would expect now. DMUs are predominantly recessed in West Yard or the Carriage sidings as required. There also a healthy amount of additional charters, excursions and Footex trains to handle in addition to the normal booked traffic. these utilise STN coaching stock sets which were reserved for these extra workings, and whatever loco the power desk has available to run them. Several are operated by DMUs Coal traffic has a major role to play in the area. This timetable is set prior to the 1984 miners strike, and also prior to the construction of Selby new mine. Virtually all the pits in the area were still open and producing rail borne coal traffic for industry, domestic usage and power station supply. NCB was also exporting coal via Immingham NCB terminal and Goole Docks. Supply for power stations comes entirely from British mines including those closed during or after the strike and replaced by Selby New mine. Thorpe Marsh power station is open and receives regular MGR traffic. Keadby Power station is open as a reserve station and continues to receive coal in "conventional loads" being unloaded by a Tippler. Coal was supplied via MGR to Scunthorpe Coal handling plant (CHP) to be coked for steel production. Scunthorpe also receives trainload Coke direct from Orgreave & Brookhouse in ex LMS pattern HCO hoppers. MGR Traffic is mostly operated using 47/3s fitted with slow speed control, although other locos like Class 20s and 37s also made appearances. While the class 56s had started to be brought online, they were mostly centralised in Cardiff, Toton & Tinsley and weren't yet fully commissioned. MGR traffic in this period operates as Class 6 (fully fitted company train) regardless of its actual booked speed. MGR utilises HAA wagons only, as other variants had yet to be introduced. Conventional domestic & industrial coal traffic uses a mix of 16 ton mineral tipplers (MCV/MCO) and 20 ton Hoppers (HTO/HTV) depending on the traffic conveyed. By this time most traffic used HTVs and unloaded via drops at Coal Concentration depots and industrial sites. MCVs were mainly used where Tippler equipment was required or wagons were to be unloaded manually or with diggers. HEA hoppers are in the process of being introduced to replace older wagons (tops code HBA in 1981) and these were mixed in with older wagons until they had gradually replaced them. As built, a large number were vacuum piped to facilitate this. There are frequent flows of oil traffic from Immingham to various Oil Terminals across the country, and a flow from Stanlow to Torksey near Lincoln. Other flows include Bitumen traffic from Kilnhurst to Ripple Lane, and a flow from Teesport to Royston Oil Terminal. Wagonload traffic still prevails and is moved mostly in class 8 partially fitted trains with a mixture of unfitted and vacuum fitted wagons, which are remarshalled in Belmont and Down Decoy for onward travel. Speedlink operates a comprehensive air braked network of wagonload traffic utilising newer wagons which are slowly replacing the older vacuum braked variants. Most steel traffic was handled in wagonload and speedlink workings, although some dedicated block company trains also run. Of note is the volume of freight running via the joint line between Gainsborough and Doncaster. This was a preferred route for freight to and from Anglia as the line between Spalding & March was still open and provided a useful way for slow freight to avoid the ECML completely. "We don't stop camborne wednesdays" Log in to reply The following users said thank you: sunocske, bugsy, flabberdacks, welshdave257, moonraker, Soton_Speed, Banners88, mldaureol, trolleybus, KCRCRailway |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 25/07/2024 at 19:41 #157920 | |
bugsy
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I'm really looking forward to playing this when it's available, but have to complete my current game of Doncaster North first though. This may be wishful thinking, but I'm wondering if a Doncaster North 1981 tt is now going to happen 🤞 Everything that you make will be useful - providing it's made of chocolate. Log in to reply |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 26/07/2024 at 08:10 #157921 | |
Andy174
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Thanks for all the work you've put into this TT, really looking forward to it once I've purchased the sim😁
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Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 26/07/2024 at 08:44 #157922 | |
kbarber
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Just a side-note on freight train classes/speeds at the date of this timetable. Classes 7 & 8 were partly-fitted and class 9 was entirely unfitted at this time. I don't think they actually had official speed bands; drivers were expected to drive according to the brake force they had available (though the later speed bands probably work pretty well). Class 6 was wagons rated for up to 60mph; likewise cl4 was up to 75mph. This had the interesting effect that the TOPS train list for a train of ferry vans (100kmph = 62mph) would appear as a class 4. Signalmen beware if the yard supervisor wasn't sufficiently on the ball to down-class it on his own initiative! I think it was sometime in 1983 (certainly by 1984) that the Rule Book and appendices had an amendment that included reclassifying freight trains; thenceforth the only trains permitted to run with unfitted portions were class 9, the familiar speed bands were implemented for classes 7 and 8 and class 6 & 4 were amended to be 60mph and 75mph respectively. Log in to reply The following user said thank you: flabberdacks |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 26/07/2024 at 09:09 #157923 | |
moonraker
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Fairly sure that the Class 123 and 124 sets were all merged by this date. The sets were all 4 car and a power car of each class per set. Certainly remember going to Donny Works for the final line up of withdrawn Deltics in 1982 and this was the case having caught one from Sheffield.
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Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 26/07/2024 at 11:04 #157925 | |
bill_gensheet
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kbarber in post 157922 said:Just a side-note on freight train classes/speeds at the date of this timetable.That explains a couple of odd class 4's I have got in my WOLV & WAL 1975 TT's, thanks. My 1975 WTT's also have speed 'options' within the class 6's. '6+' was for 60 mph, while '6♣' (club symbol) was for 55 mph. In both cases no 4 wheelers with wheelbaes of 10ft or less permitted. There were also symbols ♠ (spade) for 'no vehicles under 18ft wheelbase' and ♠♠ (double spade) for'no 4 or 6 wheeled vehicles', mostly shown against parcels / ECS trains. Log in to reply The following user said thank you: kbarber |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 26/07/2024 at 13:02 #157927 | |
swiftaw
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Played the first 2:30 so far. One minor note 6T65 is missing the Number 1 indicator for the Down Decoy Reception Sidings (OT65 has it).
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Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 26/07/2024 at 17:51 #157929 | |
jc92
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kbarber in post 157922 said:Just a side-note on freight train classes/speeds at the date of this timetable.Interestingly enough, the Brookhouse/Orgreaves to Scunthorpe Coke trains were supposedly the fastest unfitted trains on the network at the time. The WTT shows them class 9 as far as Tinsley East Jcn and they then change to class 8 and were authorised to run up to 35mph despite only having the brakeforce of two locos and a brake van on a fully loaded train. Echoes of the GCR runners living on Albeit further north. "We don't stop camborne wednesdays" Log in to reply |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 27/07/2024 at 18:29 #157947 | |
officer dibble
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Up to 0700 (Tuesday) with delays on, having a whale of a time! Couple of bits to note/seek clarification on if possible please; 6T04/236T04C07 0005 Down Decoy - Yorkshire Main - backs in all the way from SC Loops - is this correct? 0T10/230T10C01 - attaches to DDS6 and forms 6T10/236T10C01 towards Adwick with the loco propelling all the way. 6D48/226D48C01 0603 Scunthorpe - Yorkshire Main - as per 6T04 above. "ya know...OLD...ER than some people...but, uh, YOUNGER than...some buildings." Log in to reply |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 27/07/2024 at 20:46 #157949 | |
jc92
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officer dibble in post 157947 said:Up to 0700 (Tuesday) with delays on, having a whale of a time!The Yorkshire main traffic did indeed propel along the branch. its shown in the WTT for the Scunthorpe CHP workings and is authorised explicitly in the Sectional appendix (no brake van required!). There were "36 wagon" markers at both ends of the branch for the drivers benefit when propelling. I have no idea why this was the case as run round facilities were available at Yorkshire Main. 0T10/DDS6 - I'll form one the shunter and make a note of it. I'm going to wait for any further issues before issuing an update. bugsy in post 157920 said: I'm really looking forward to playing this when it's available, but have to complete my current game of Doncaster North first though.As it stands, I have: Doncaster North - 99% written but awaiting a couple of minor pathing/location issues to be resolved which are logged. Doncaster South - Written, needs testing and some minor amendments to make Peterborough - Written and first test complete. several trains require alteration and amendment. further testing required. Kings Cross - Suitable information acquired for this but given the size and complexity, its not on my immediate radar. In the long term it'll be nice to achieve Kings cross - Temple Hirst chainable. Cambridge - Unlikely to be done. currently insufficient information and it depends on any revised simulation including the Spalding-March which is out of scope of the PSB era. Royston - Likely to be done as and when Kings Cross is done North Humberside - I have the information to go north east via Selby and Goole through to Hull and Scarborough should a suitable sim/sims ever be produced. West Yorks, Sheffield, York North/South - sims aren't suitable for a 1981 timetable. For now I'm going over to the West Mids in 1992 to try and get out Saltley, Leamington and Walsall. "We don't stop camborne wednesdays" Last edited: 27/07/2024 at 20:59 by jc92 Reason: None given Log in to reply The following users said thank you: sunocske, flabberdacks, officer dibble, Javelin395 |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 28/07/2024 at 05:13 #157954 | |
0D07
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Yeah that is correct it was in the Sectional Appendix and Method of work for trains to propel from St Caths Jn to Yorkshire Main Colliery. 0D07 Log in to reply |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 28/07/2024 at 11:17 #157957 | |
flabberdacks
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0L05/230L05C01 doesn't have a platform nominated nor a stopping position - it travels all the way to the far end of plat 3B when signalled that way and then comes all the way back along 3B when departing towards Bridge Jn. Not sure if you wanted to specify stopping at the near end of 3B for that one? Not a big deal edit: 8L05/238L05C01 enters at 0600 but isn't due past Doncaster until 0700, is that right? Last edited: 28/07/2024 at 11:43 by flabberdacks Reason: None given Log in to reply |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 28/07/2024 at 15:06 #157960 | |
Banners88
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jc92 in post 157949 said:officer dibble in post 157947 said:Real shame that the Sheffield sim isn't able to travel back in time.Up to 0700 (Tuesday) with delays on, having a whale of a time!The Yorkshire main traffic did indeed propel along the branch. its shown in the WTT for the Scunthorpe CHP workings and is authorised explicitly in the Sectional appendix (no brake van required!). There were "36 wagon" markers at both ends of the branch for the drivers benefit when propelling. I have no idea why this was the case as run round facilities were available at Yorkshire Main. Log in to reply |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 28/07/2024 at 15:26 #157961 | |
0D07
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Yeah it is a shame that 0D07 Log in to reply |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 28/07/2024 at 15:30 #157962 | |
0D07
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North Humberside or East Yorkshire would be nice I herd once that it was in development but that must have been over 11 or 12 years ago now. 0D07 Log in to reply |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 28/07/2024 at 20:03 #157965 | |
jc92
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flabberdacks in post 157957 said:0L05/230L05C01 doesn't have a platform nominated nor a stopping position - it travels all the way to the far end of plat 3B when signalled that way and then comes all the way back along 3B when departing towards Bridge Jn. Not sure if you wanted to specify stopping at the near end of 3B for that one? Not a big deal3B platform added. 8L05 should enter 06:50 per description. entry time was wrong and has now been amended. Cheers "We don't stop camborne wednesdays" Log in to reply |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 29/07/2024 at 06:14 #157969 | |
clive
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jc92 in post 157949 said:The revised Cambridge will cover the same area as the original one. The section between Manea and Peterborough is a very simplified one intended to provide just enough to connect it with the Peterborough sim and to allow trains to originate or terminate in the March area. If you want (say) Spalding to Ely trains over the old line, then just have them enter/leave at one of the yards. That's the best I can offer; sorry. Log in to reply |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 29/07/2024 at 15:59 #157973 | |
KCRCRailway
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Now only need to buy another monitor then I can solo York to Doncaster, how exciting
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Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 03/08/2024 at 19:55 #158035 | |
bugsy
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Is the arrow pointing at Down Decoy Siding No.6? If so, then why is 0T10 complaining of a wrong route? That's where DD56 is waiting for it. Of course, it could be that I need a new pair of glasses. It just so happens that I have an eye test the week after next. ......... ![]() Edit: Ooops. Forgot to add the arrow 🙄 Post has attachments. Log in to view them. Everything that you make will be useful - providing it's made of chocolate. Last edited: 03/08/2024 at 19:56 by bugsy Reason: None given Log in to reply |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 03/08/2024 at 20:03 #158037 | |
eps125
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bugsy in post 158035 said:Is the arrow pointing at Down Decoy Siding No.6?Thanks for this, however it has already been reported as Mantis 40977. Log in to reply |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 03/08/2024 at 20:34 #158040 | |
bugsy
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eps125 in post 158037 said:bugsy in post 158035 said:Oh, OK. I don't make a note of all the items that are in Mantis so I wasn't aware and I didn't look back at the posts when perhaps I should have done.Is the arrow pointing at Down Decoy Siding No.6?Thanks for this, however it has already been reported as Mantis 40977. I'll wait for an update of the sim and continue from my latest save. Everything that you make will be useful - providing it's made of chocolate. Log in to reply |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 15/08/2024 at 10:06 #158195 | |
zak bevington
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I’d just like to add too that light loco movements from Doncaster L.I.P to down decoy via St Cath’s jn don’t work if you work them through up decoy (US2). However if you run them through US4 they do work and can then be signalled into there allocated siding at down decoy. Just posting this hear in case anyone else might need help with this as I was pulling my hair out for the first couple hours of the sim LOL.
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Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 15/08/2024 at 12:22 #158198 | |
flabberdacks
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zak bevington in post 158195 said:I’d just like to add too that light loco movements from Doncaster L.I.P to down decoy via St Cath’s jn don’t work if you work them through up decoy (US2). However if you run them through US4 they do work and can then be signalled into there allocated siding at down decoy. Just posting this hear in case anyone else might need help with this as I was pulling my hair out for the first couple hours of the sim LOL.This is interesting - what about it doesn't work? I admit I always used US4 during my playthrough, didn't try the others Log in to reply |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 15/08/2024 at 16:55 #158201 | |
jc92
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Are you correctly working the handpoints and signals on the shunt panel? I've had no such issues throughout testing or a current test of a different tt. Trains into carr loco have to use sdg 4 but trains out shouldn't have any issues, otherwise you'd get issues with the pway trains which stable on 1-4 sdgs. "We don't stop camborne wednesdays" Last edited: 15/08/2024 at 16:55 by jc92 Reason: None given Log in to reply |
Doncaster 1981 Summer Weekdays 16/08/2024 at 15:14 #158209 | |
zak bevington
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Yes I used the up decoy shunter panel to change points and signals out of sidings and the train was still stood in the siding. It’s no big deal however I’ll just use US4 as that works for me. May I add too it’s a really good timetable, I can tell a lot of time and effort has gone into this and maybe the best timetable I’ve ever played
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