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| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 14:21 #134537 | |
postal
5265 posts |
mjkerr in post 134525 said:My understanding of the instructions is that the CSV files are for reference onlyI have opened a sim, created a TT with a handful of trains and then exported that data to CSV using the "Export" button. That gave me three CSV files for Categories, Down and Up. Closed and then re-opened the sim, clicked on the "Import" button three times and imported the three CSVs which gave me an identical TT to the one I had exported. “In life, there is always someone out there, who won’t like you, for whatever reason, don’t let the insecurities in their lives affect yours.” – Rashida Rowe Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 14:34 #134538 | |
mjkerr
195 posts |
postal in post 134537 said:I have opened a sim, created a TT with a handful of trains and then exported that data to CSV using the "Export" button. That gave me three CSV files for Categories, Down and Up. Closed and then re-opened the sim, clicked on the "Import" button three times and imported the three CSVs which gave me an identical TT to the one I had exported. I can export the Timetable, creates the three files However, when I import I am presented with the Sim Convert and ConvData interface DELETED Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 14:44 #134540 | |
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Albert
1315 posts |
bill_gensheet in post 134529 said:Convdata only works with '.exe' sims. It cannot work with loader at any version.As Bill said, could you confirm which version of Carlisle you are using by clicking Help > About in the 'hamburger' menu? AJP in games Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 14:49 #134541 | |
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mjkerr
195 posts |
Albert in post 134540 said:As Bill said, could you confirm which version of Carlisle you are using by clicking Help > About in the 'hamburger' menu? SimSig Loader version 5.8 Simulation Carlisle; data version 4.3 DELETED Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 14:59 #134542 | |
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bill_gensheet
1413 posts |
Loader 5.12 still has the convdata interface under : Burger -> timetable -> export/import -> To/from text format However the CSV import / export function lives in Burger -> timetable -> edit (or F4) Tools 1 Export Now .. Import Now .. So you need to have created a blank timetable to import into Bill Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 15:06 #134543 | |
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mjkerr
195 posts |
bill_gensheet in post 134542 said:Loader 5.12 still has the convdata interface under : That is the one I am now trying to use So it is possible? DELETED Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 15:09 #134544 | |
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mjkerr
195 posts |
bill_gensheet in post 134529 said:In any case you would need to use the sim internal location name for Oxenholme not 'OXENHOLME LAKE DISTRICT' I became aware of that as soon as LAKE appeared Where do I find the DEP location list for Carlisle? DELETED Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 15:27 #134545 | |
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postal
5265 posts |
mjkerr in post 134543 said:bill_gensheet in post 134542 said:Bit more explanation as you need to be working from the F4 TT window and not the drop down menu. I created a simple TT and used the"Export Now" button on the Tools 1 tab of the F4 window which generated three CSV files in the same folder as the TT. I then closed and reopened the sim with no TT selected. I then again opened the F4 window, went to the Tools 1 tab and clicked on the "Import Now" button. This opened an Explorer window to the folder where the TTs for that sim are held and showed the three CSV files.Loader 5.12 still has the convdata interface under :  Clicked on one of them then the "Import" button at the bottom of the File Explorer window. This imported that data into the blank TT open in the sim. Did the same for the other two CSVs and got a fully functional SimSig TT which I could then save as a WTT file. Post has attachments. Log in to view them. “In life, there is always someone out there, who won’t like you, for whatever reason, don’t let the insecurities in their lives affect yours.” – Rashida Rowe Last edited: 10/12/2020 at 15:31 by postal Reason: None given Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 15:37 #134546 | |
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bill_gensheet
1413 posts |
mjkerr in post 134543 said:bill_gensheet in post 134542 said:No.Loader 5.12 still has the convdata interface under : That bit has never worked with any Loader. Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 16:03 #134547 | |
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mjkerr
195 posts |
postal in post 134545 said:you need to be working from the F4 TT window and not the drop down menu. Timetable -> Edit Found it now! DELETED Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 16:03 #134548 | |
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mjkerr
195 posts |
bill_gensheet in post 134546 said:That bit has never worked with any Loader. Darn, that would be so much easier! I can now also delete that file DELETED Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 16:05 #134549 | |
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mjkerr
195 posts |
mjkerr in post 134544 said:Where do I find the DEP location list for Carlisle? I found most of them Luckily it is the ones required for ENT However I can not enter several of the freight services yet as the TIPLOC codes are missing DELETED Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 16:06 #134550 | |
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mjkerr
195 posts |
Using these three CSV files is very messy The UP and DOWN have the same services The XLS files then need to be transposed back DELETED Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 16:21 #134551 | |
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postal
5265 posts |
Perhaps you might be better following the advice from someone who has a lot of experience of TTs ( - see what Steamer wrote here - ) rather than reinventing your own wheel.
“In life, there is always someone out there, who won’t like you, for whatever reason, don’t let the insecurities in their lives affect yours.” – Rashida Rowe Last edited: 10/12/2020 at 16:21 by postal Reason: None given Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 16:51 #134553 | |
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clive
2789 posts |
Oh, good grief. Let me try and explain some history. SimSig for a long time used what is internally called the v2 timetable format. This is documented at https://www.davros.org/rail/SimSig/wtt-format.html Contrary to what some people have said, the Loader did use v2 for a while. I wanted to be able to use a text editor to write timetables, so I invented a text notation for them and wrote a program - ConvData - to convert back and forwards between that and the v2 format. I also added features to make it easier to write timetables; see https://www.davros.org/rail/SimSig/mktimetable.html Then, for very good reasons, Geoff moved the timetable format to use XML within ZIP files. This is the v3 format. It's a lot easier to extend than the v2 format. Some of the things in timetables - like decisions - just aren't available in v2, only v3. I don't remember when it was, but since then the Loader has only written v3 format, though it can still read v2 files. So if you use the ConvData text format to create a timetable, you can then run it in SimSig but you can't convert any changes back to text. If you want to use a text editor to edit timetables, then simply rename the .WTT file to .ZIP and look inside; there will be two XML files which you can edit in many ways since they are plain text. Beware that the Loader doesn't validate the XML, so if you make a syntax error then things will go strange. While a bit of me would like to write a ConvData 3 that understands both v2 and v3 and provides the facilities that ConvData has, in reality I don't have the time or energy. If someone wants to do it, they're very welcome to do so. If they can convince me they're genuine, they can even have my source code. Log in to reply The following users said thank you: postal, Steamer |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 17:15 #134554 | |
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mjkerr
195 posts |
clive in post 134553 said:If you want to use a text editor to edit timetables, then simply rename the .WTT file to .ZIP and look inside; there will be two XML files which you can edit in many ways since they are plain text. Beware that the Loader doesn't validate the XML, so if you make a syntax error then things will go strange Excellent, having all the TIPLOC codes now has also helped DELETED Last edited: 10/12/2020 at 18:43 by mjkerr Reason: None given Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 19:41 #134561 | |
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mjkerr
195 posts |
Clearly only the use of three CSV files will work As above, I have created the Categories.csv file This imports and appears correctly When converting from XLS to CSV, the time entries were saving as time formats instead of text These now import However, the time order is not correct I have tried Up then Down, and Down then Up It makes no difference It does seem strange to have the same train in both the Up and Down files DELETED Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 19:45 #134562 | |
pedroathome
915 posts 
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mjkerr in post 134561 said:Taking Manchester North as an example, all trains are up to Victoria, so a train passing through would be in the up file from Salford as far as Victoria, and then in the down heading onwards to vitriol works or Baguley fold Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 19:48 #134563 | |
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mjkerr
195 posts |
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DELETED Last edited: 10/12/2020 at 19:52 by mjkerr Reason: None given Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 19:51 #134564 | |
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mjkerr
195 posts |
I used the 2000 Up and Down as a template from 1M06 for the timing points used for a Up Glasgow - Euston -> 1M18: Arrival time at Carlisle earlier than previous location time 1M18: Arrival time at Lockerbie earlier than previous location time 1M18: Dep/pass time at Carlisle earlier than previous location time 1M18: Dep/pass time at Kirkpatrick S862 earlier than previous location time 1M18: Dep/pass time at Lockerbie earlier than previous location time 1M18: Final location should not have a departure time specified 1M18: Has locations after exit point Carlisle (will not reappear in the simulation) 1M18: Origin location should not have an arrival time specified 
Post has attachments. Log in to view them. DELETED Last edited: 10/12/2020 at 19:52 by mjkerr Reason: None given Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 19:58 #134565 | |
Steamer
3985 posts |
mjkerr in post 134561 said:Clearly only the use of three CSV files will workYou'll need to attach the .CSV and corresponding .WTT files you're creating so people can see what's going on. Trains appearing in both files will definitely happen if a train reverses at any point, and where the line direction changes (e.g. a train from the S&C to the Cumbrian Coast will be a Down train until the Carlisle avoiding lines, at which point it becomes an Up train). Again, I would ask why you're determined to do things this way, rather than using the built-in TT editor, which is rather more user-friendly. "Don't stress/ relax/ let life roll off your backs./ Except for death and paying taxes/ everything in life.../ is only for now." (Avenue Q) Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 20:05 #134566 | |
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mjkerr
195 posts |
Steamer in post 134565 said:I would ask why you're determined to do things this way, rather than using the built-in TT editor, which is rather more user-friendly. Using spreadsheet, convert to CSV, then import DELETED Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 20:08 #134567 | |
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mjkerr
195 posts |
At last 1M18 in the correct order However, why has Kirtlebridge appeared, when it is not in the XLS or CSV file?  Post has attachments. Log in to view them. DELETED Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 20:09 #134568 | |
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postal
5265 posts |
1) IIRC the TT does not sort properly if there are key locations missing which could be the cause of the original problem e.g. Penrith which shows in your latest attempt (although the locations are sometimes interpolated by the core code). 2) Probably due to the history of the sim where trains originally entered and dropped off at KF. When the sim was extended to Lockerbie it could have broken the previous TTs if the KF location was ignored so the original developer probably set the code to interpolate the KF timing if it was not present. When do you start paying or saying thank you for the hours of free consultancy you are receiving? At normal consultancy charge out rates you are well into three figures by now. “In life, there is always someone out there, who won’t like you, for whatever reason, don’t let the insecurities in their lives affect yours.” – Rashida Rowe Last edited: 10/12/2020 at 20:21 by postal Reason: None given Log in to reply |
| Partial timeable information 10/12/2020 at 20:15 #134569 | |
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Steamer
3985 posts |
postal in post 134568 said:IIRC the TT does not sort properly if there are key locations missing which could be the case here.Now you mention it, I notice Penrith was missing from the original screenshot. mjkerr said: However, why has Kirtlebridge appeared, when it is not in the XLS or CSV file?It's an auto-inserted location (notice it's in lower case); the sim does this automatically. If I remember rightly, it won't appear in the 'Show timetable' window when playing. "Don't stress/ relax/ let life roll off your backs./ Except for death and paying taxes/ everything in life.../ is only for now." (Avenue Q) Last edited: 10/12/2020 at 20:15 by Steamer Reason: None given Log in to reply |